U.S.A. vs. Canada. RWCQ 1st leg, 17/08/13

[LittleGuy]

Why the lack of Underwood love? I thought he played well in the PNC, while Braid struggled a lot. Also LG, has Marshall ever played at loosehead? I know Tiedemann is a better tighthead than loosehead, but that is a strange switch to make, IMO.

I just hate Tieddemann at loose, I'd almost go in your direction and have Wooldridge start ahead of him if Marshall can't play there. I liked Underwood, think Braid is alittle more steady though I have a feeling the coaching staff aren't starting Briad if he's playing in the CRC this weekend.

 

[canadafan]

Let's be honest here, if we are going to give Tiedemann some time at loosehead and see if he has gotten any better at that position, this is the time to do it.

 

[Big Ewis]

I screwed up the USA ranking they are 18th not 19th....maybe I shouldn't have mentioned since no one noticed.... The correct rank has been edited in.

hahahah

and yeh was just checking out the IRB rankings there, and it seems pretty insane Italy is just 2 ranks on top of Japan ! Just roughly two points away...rankings really don't mean crap...

 

[LittleGuy]

26 Man squad for the two games has been named by Crowley....no Beukeboom is slightly surprising. Guess Phelan will be backing up Hotson and Cudmore. As I somewhat suspected with him being named to the Bears side, Braid has also been left out. PD will be pleased as Paris has also been left out of the side(perhaps Crowley didn't want to press his new D2 club for his release).

Tyler Ardron, (Ospreys/Ontario Blues) Lakefield, ON
Ray Barkwill, (Niagara Wasps RFC/Ontario Blues) Niagara Falls, ON
Nick Blevins, (Calgary Hornets/Prairie Wolf Pack) Calgary, AB
Aaron Carpenter, Captain, (Cornish Pirates) Brantford, ON
Jamie Cudmore, (ASM Clermont Auvergne) Squamish, BC
Nanyak Dala, (Castaway Wanderers/Prairie Wolf Pack) Saskatoon, SK
Tom Dolezel, (London St. George’s/Ontario Blues) London, ON
Matt Evans, (Cornish Pirates) Maple Bay, BC
Ryan Hamilton, (Capilano RFC/BC Bears) Vancouver, BC
Jeff Hassler, (Ospreys/Prairie Wolf Pack) Okotoks, AB
Ciaran Hearn, (Castaway Wanderers/Atlantic Rock) Conception Bay, NL
Nathan Hirayama, (UVIC Vikes/BC Bears) Richmond, BC
Tyler Hotson, (London Scottish) Vancouver, BC
Harry Jones, (Capilano RFC/BC Bears) West Vancouver, BC
Phil Mack, (Uvic Vikes, BC Bears) Victoria, BC
Phil Mackenzie, (Sale Sharks) Oakville, ON
Jason Marshall, (Atlantique Stade Rochelais/BC Bears) Vancouver, BC
John Moonlight, (James Bay AA/Ontario Blues) Pickering, ON
Jon Phelan, (Lille Métropole Rugby/Atlantic Rock) Montreal, QC
James Pritchard, (Bedford Blues) Parkes, NSW, Australia
Jebb Sinclair, (London Irish) Fredericton, NB
Andrew Tiedemann, (Castaway Wanderers/Prairie Wolf Pack) St. Albert, AB
Liam Underwood, (Queens University/Ontario Blues) Toronto, ON
DTH Van Der Merwe, (Glasgow Warriors) Regina, SK
Sean White, (James Bay AA/BC Bears) Victoria, BC
Doug Wooldridge, (Lindsay RFC/Ontario Blues) Lindsay, ON

 

[psychic duck]

hahahah

and yeh was just checking out the IRB rankings there, and it seems pretty insane Italy is just 2 ranks on top of Japan ! Just roughly two points away...rankings really don't mean crap...

So why exactly is that "insane"?

 

[canadafan]

Paris didn't play well in June so not surprised he is left out, ****** off that Hirayama is in but other than that no problems with the squad.

Apparently Emerick has retired today, big loss for the yanks.

 

[Jaguares]

Canada will have new shirt this year?

So...

 

[LittleGuy]

So...

We change our jersey's bi-weekly so it's very likely.

 

[canadafan]

We usually play the U.S. at home in the retro (red) jersey. Will probably play them next weekend in our regular jersey.

 

[LittleGuy]

My lineup from this named side....

1.Tieddemann(I hate to put him here)
2.Barkwill
3.Marshall
4.Cudmore
5.Hotson
6.Ardron
7.Sinclair
8.Carpenter
9.White(or Mack don't care here)
10.Underwood
11.Evans
12.Mackenzie
13.Van De Merwe
14.Hassler
15.Pritchard

16.Hamilton
17.Wooldridge
18.Dolezel
19.Phelan
20.Dala
21.Mack(or White whoever dosen't start)
22.Jones or Blevins
23.Hearn

Left off....
Moonlight
Blevins or Jones
Hirayama

 

[canadafan]

My lineup from this named side....

1.Tieddemann(I hate to put him here)
2.Barkwill
3.Marshall
4.Cudmore
5.Hotson
6.Ardron
7.Sinclair
8.Carpenter
9.White(or Mack don't care here)
10.Underwood
11.Evans
12.Mackenzie
13.Van De Merwe
14.Hassler
15.Pritchard

16.Hamilton
17.Wooldridge
18.Dolezel
19.Phelan
20.Dala
21.Mack(or White whoever dosen't start)
22.Jones or Blevins
23.Hearn

Left off....
Moonlight
Blevins or Jones
Hirayama

God I hope Hirayama is not starting, but then, why have him in the squad? You have a solid squad though.

 

[LittleGuy]

God I hope Hirayama is not starting, but then, why have him in the squad? You have a solid squad though.

I have a feeling you might be right, maybe he will be on the bench but I find him much worse off the bench, he never seems to get into a game if he comes on in the final half hour or less.

 

[canadafan]

I can stomach him on the bench, but Underwood should be starting, he was much better in June. Hirayama's supporters will point to the Tongan game as 'how good he can be' but he only looked that good because Tonga lost the plot big time and he STILL nearly threw away that game!

 

[psychic duck]

What's the problem with Hirayama? He's got a really nice pass on him and can break, he has weaknesses but his strengths are strong enough to remain around the squad imo. I'd probably prefer him on the bench as opposed to Jones or Blevins with Hearn covering so many positions. Although I'd rather Braid who along with Duke (injured?) has been a bit unlucky not making the squad tbh.

I can stomach him on the bench, but Underwood should be starting, he was much better in June. Hirayama's supporters will point to the Tongan game as 'how good he can be' but he only looked that good because Tonga lost the plot big time and he STILL nearly threw away that game!

You say Tonga lost the plot which is fair, but Hirayama created the break that led to them going down to 13 men and did play the extra man advantage well in stretching Tonga.

 

[canadafan]

Hiryama floats passes to often and they are ripe for an intercept try (happened in the Tongan game). Also he is not mentally tough enough to play XVs, he literally played scared against Ireland, is weak on defence and when he does make a mistake he can't get over it quickly and his form drops big time during the game. Prety much it goes like this, he makes one mistake, then another and another and it just snowballs from there and we are down by about 20 after a 10 minute period in the game. That being said, if I was picking a 7s line up, he would be one of my first choice players, but this is XVs.

 

[psychic duck]

Hiryama floats passes to often and they are ripe for an intercept try (happened in the Tongan game). Also he is not mentally tough enough to play XVs, he literally played scared against Ireland, is weak on defence and when he does make a mistake he can't get over it quickly and his form drops big time during the game. Prety much it goes like this, he makes one mistake, then another and another and it just snowballs from there and we are down by about 20 after a 10 minute period in the game. That being said, if I was picking a 7s line up, he would be one of my first choice players, but this is XVs.

If he can catch a high ball or could be taught, then perhaps a move to full back out of the way of a crucial decision making position but where his attacking flair can still be utilised could be an idea then.

 

[canadafan]

If he can catch a high ball or could be taught, then perhaps a move to full back out of the way of a crucial decision making position but where his attacking flair can still be utilised could be an idea then.

Well, his weaknesses would be more hidden at FB, that's for sure. His real problem in the XVs is his mental toughness, he is just too prone to brainfarts on the pitch. TBH, I feel that he is just holding down the fort until one of O'Leary, Underwood or McCann are ready for prime time. Right now, much to my disgust, he will most likely be starting with Underwood coming off the bench so not to put too much pressure on Underwood.

 

[LittleGuy]

Interesting time for Emerick to retire...was he going to be left off the side anyway? Did he get into the Eagles camp and realize he just didn't have that little extra? A solid player over the years, but lost his head a couple of times, in particular in 2009 RWCQ when he stomped DTH and was sent off, Canada completely pulled away in the game after that.

Edit: Never mind, found out it was an ankle injury.....http://www.espnscrum.com/blogs/rugby/story/193613.html

 

[canadafan]

Looks like Centres is a weak position for the U.S. now, apparently Hume migh have injrued himself playing 7s recently too.

 

[CDN_Rugby]

My lineup from this named side....

1.Tieddemann(I hate to put him here)
2.Barkwill
3.Marshall
4.Cudmore
5.Hotson
6.Ardron
7.Sinclair
8.Carpenter
9.White(or Mack don't care here)
10.Underwood
11.Evans
12.Mackenzie
13.Van De Merwe
14.Hassler
15.Pritchard

16.Hamilton
17.Wooldridge
18.Dolezel
19.Phelan
20.Dala
21.Mack(or White whoever dosen't start)
22.Jones or Blevins
23.Hearn

Left off....
Moonlight
Blevins or Jones
Hirayama

I agree with this 100%. I wouldn't necessarily be opposed to swapping Jones or Blevins for Hirayama though, Hirayama isn't half as bad as some people make him out to be. Surprised about Beukeboom's omission as well.

 

[canadafan]

Hey guys, is there a CRC thread anywhere? B.C. Bears are playing the Wolfpack this weekend.

 

[LittleGuy]

Hey guys, is there a CRC thread anywhere? B.C. Bears are playing the Wolfpack this weekend.

Yeah I should have set it up a while ago in the General rugby.

Edit: I can't find it, I wonder if it got lost in the forum reorginizxation a few months back I'll set up a new one.

 

[psychic duck]

Interesting time for Emerick to retire...was he going to be left off the side anyway? Did he get into the Eagles camp and realize he just didn't have that little extra? A solid player over the years, but lost his head a couple of times, in particular in 2009 RWCQ when he stomped DTH and was sent off, Canada completely pulled away in the game after that.

Edit: Never mind, found out it was an ankle injury.....http://www.espnscrum.com/blogs/rugby/story/193613.html

There's been more talented, but few better servants to USA rugby than Emerick. Big loss actually, he looked like he still had quite a bit to offer last year, injury must have been really serious. The USA should move Wyles to 13 now and bring in their big hope Madison Hughes at 15 if not now but within the next 12 months.

 

[Canadian_Rugger]

I have a feeling if there has ever been a time to lay a beating on the US this is the time for our boys to do it. We have some very potent attacking threats in that lineup and with a pack containing the likes of Cudmore, Ardon and Sinclair we are bringing some serious physicality to the table. It is funny how many good back-row players we are able to produce, I would say it is by far our strongest position.

 

[Shaggy]

I'd definitely start Moonlight, as he was the best Canadian option at openside, in the PNC, IMO ... got to start Tiedemann too ... he's got to be the best option, as he's from St Albert, Alberta

... should be a great match ... I'll have to set the PVR, as I"m off to donate cash to the Alberta Racing Industry that day (Canadian Derby)

 

[psychic duck]

I have a feeling if there has ever been a time to lay a beating on the US this is the time for our boys to do it. We have some very potent attacking threats in that lineup and with a pack containing the likes of Cudmore, Ardon and Sinclair we are bringing some serious physicality to the table. It is funny how many good back-row players we are able to produce, I would say it is by far our strongest position.

Lots of versatile wingers being produced currently by Canada as well.. In previous years Canada produced a lot of locks as well with James, Cudmore, Charron, Tait, Yukes, Jackson and Hadley and some had to be moved to the back row to fit them all in. Now it's roles reversed and the back rowers play in the locks.

 

[RWC2011Fan]

Which side has more professionals?

 

[LittleGuy]

Which side has more professionals?

I'm not sure since I haven't seen the U.S.A. lineup...my guess is Canada by a tiny bit, but essentially the same amount.

 

[Canadian_Rugger]

Which side has more professionals?

Using LittleGuy's picks Canada's Starting XV is almost entirely professional

1.Tieddemann - Not signed this year (Played pro for FC Auch last year Pro D2)
2.Barkwill - Ontario Blues (Amateur)
3.Marshall - Stade Rochelais (Pro D2)
4.Cudmore - Clermont (Top 14)
5.Hotson - London Scottish (RFU Championship)
6.Ardron - Ospreys (Pro12)
7.Sinclair - London Irish (Aviva Premiership)
8.Carpenter - Cornish Pirates (RFU Championship)
9.White - BC Bears (Amateur)
10.Underwood - Ontario Blues (Amateur)
11.Evans - Cornish Pirates (RFU Championship)
12.Mackenzie - Sale Sharks (Aviva Premiership)
13.Van De Merwe - Glasgow Warriors (Pro12)
14.Hassler - Ospreys (Pro12)
15.Pritchard - Bedford Blues (RFU Championship)

16.Hamilton - BC Bears
17.Wooldridge - Ontario Blues
18.Dolezel - Ontario Blues
19.Phelan - Lille (Federale 1 France)
20.Dala - Prairie Wolfpack
21.Mack - BC Bears
22.Jones or Blevins - BC Bears
23.Hearnn- The Rock

Of note we are missing a couple of our pros and some didn't make the grade:

Taylor Paris - Agen (Pro D2)
Hubert Buydens - Manawatu (NPC)
Brett Beukeboom - Plymouth Albion (RFU Championship)

 

[canadafan]

Using LittleGuy's picks Canada's Starting XV is almost entirely professional

1.Tieddemann - Not signed this year (Played pro for FC Auch last year Pro D2)
2.Barkwill - Ontario Blues (Amateur)
3.Marshall - Stade Rochelais (Pro D2)
4.Cudmore - Clermont (Top 14)
5.Hotson - London Scottish (RFU Championship)
6.Ardron - Ospreys (Pro12)
7.Sinclair - London Irish (Aviva Premiership)
8.Carpenter - Cornish Pirates (RFU Championship)
9.White - BC Bears (Amateur)
10.Underwood - Ontario Blues (Amateur)
11.Evans - Cornish Pirates (RFU Championship)
12.Mackenzie - Sale Sharks (Aviva Premiership)
13.Van De Merwe - Glasgow Warriors (Pro12)
14.Hassler - Ospreys (Pro12)
15.Pritchard - Bedford Blues (RFU Championship)

16.Hamilton - BC Bears
17.Wooldridge - Ontario Blues
18.Dolezel - Ontario Blues
19.Phelan - Lille (Federale 1 France)
20.Dala - Prairie Wolfpack
21.Mack - BC Bears
22.Jones or Blevins - BC Bears
23.Hearnn- The Rock

Of note we are missing a couple of our pros and some didn't make the grade:

Taylor Paris - Agen (Pro D2)
Hubert Buydens - Manawatu (NPC)
Brett Beukeboom - Plymouth Albion (RFU Championship)

Man, that list is looking much better. Pretty sure there are a few others on the list too. Of the up and comers:

Pierce (lock) (Pro D2)
McCann 1st5/FB Clermont Academy
O'Leary 1st5 Grenoble (Pro D2)
DSD loosehead prop (Northampton Academy) (I think)