Note to heineke meyer.

[TRF_heineken]

To be honest I find all this cynicism about our country to be very wearying. In the end we don't have a quota system in rugby and I don't think we will in the near future. The 50% goal is just that a goal not enforceable policy and since roughly 30% of our squad were people of colour this year 50% isn't that far off, especially since I think a lesser number will be accepted closer to the world cup. Anyone who says we didn't win this world cup because of political interference is talking utter nonsense, we lost for many reasons and if racial quotas was one of those reasons it was a very very small one.
Also the number of quality black players should continue to increase as inequality in the country evens out, so I think we can probably find ourselves in a place where we are only slightly weakened by quota goals.

As for Heineke Meyer, I've come to the decision that I'd be happy with him having another four years, partly because I think it takes more than 4 years to build a championship team and partly because I don't see many other options. I did recently read an article that claimed HM said we don't have the requisite skills to play an expansive game, and if true I'd rather Heineke does get fired, I'm inclined to think the article is ,making stuff up though, what do you guys think? Heinken you generally have good bull#### spotting abilities: http://www.sport24.co.za/Rugby/WorldCup/Meyer-Boks-have-no-skills-20151103

Well that article does have a point IMHO. And it's not like it's the first time HM has said that. I think he has been rather open about the skill level of the South African players and that they need to improve. Based on what I've seen there has been a little nit of improvement, but not nearly enough to get up to the same level as NZ and Aus.

I think the cynicism is a little bit shortsighted. We have been fighting this battle since 1996! And we still haven't lost the Springbok or had the enforced implementation of quota's in the Springbok team.

What many forget is that while our government would love to enforce this as yet another way of showing their ignorance and power, they forget that SARU falls under the legislation of WR (IRB) and their code of conduct, and it clearly states that no national team may discriminate against any player due to race, religion or sexual orientation. If the enforcement is going to happen, then SARU and the government is just going to start the same war as Apartheid did. And then World Rugby can enforce sanctions against us. Which could lead to the Springboks not being allowed to play any international matches, or participate in any WR sanctioned event.

And it's not like we as the fans are just going to sit back and let it happen. It think we must take the same stance as what the students did and start #QuotasmustFall movement. I know that we will have organisations that will back this movement, and one of them is Afriforum. They were one of the organisations that assisted SARU prior to the World Cup when we had the whole quota row, and that HM isn't doing enough for transformation. And the conclusion was that nobody should point the finger at HM. He's not the only selector of the players, he doesn't have any influence in what the clubs/franchises/unions do with their selection policies or whatever else they want to throw at him.

 

[WaterboySA]

Let's first listen to what the Honorable Minister of Sport has to say....

http://www.sport24.co.za/Rugby/WorldCup/Mbalula-to-discuss-Boks-transformation-20151105

I'm SO f-ing sick of this. I really hope that World Rugby BANS South Africa if there is additional interference in the team. It is time they step in.

 

[mdaclarke]

I have a feeling it is all lip service. Surely the ANC must know that the IRB and IOC would step in if they actually tried to impose a quota.

 

[TheOvalBall]

I have a feeling it is all lip service. Surely the ANC must know that the IRB and IOC would step in if they actually tried to impose a quota.

I really hope they do. The crap that has gone in the sport has gone long enough.

 

[Sonic Kiwi]

I really hope they do. The crap that has gone in the sport has gone long enough.

I'm not a black or coloured AB fan ok? I'm born and bred from NZ.

Why are Saffas whining (for want of a better word) about what colour can and won't play now? It's a joke to think that now SARU fans are blaming affirmative action based on either/or, skill or colour. SA relied on "honourable" players, NO?

What's good for the goose is good for the gander, you can't change half way through a period of making 'rules' and when the finnished result doesn't pan out for your side then throw a tantrum and then change them.

You have short memories guy's

 

[TheOvalBall]

I'm not a black or coloured AB fan ok? I'm born and bred from NZ.

Why are Saffas whining (for want of a better word) about what colour can and won't play now? It's a joke to think that now SARU fans are blaming affirmative action based on either/or, skill or colour. SA relied on "honourable" players, NO?

What's good for the goose is good for the gander, you can't change half way through a period of making 'rules' and when the finnished result doesn't pan out for your side then throw a tantrum and then change them.

You have short memories guy's

uh what?

 

[TRF_heineken]

I'm not a black or coloured AB fan ok? I'm born and bred from NZ.

Why are Saffas whining (for want of a better word) about what colour can and won't play now? It's a joke to think that now SARU fans are blaming affirmative action based on either/or, skill or colour. SA relied on "honourable" players, NO?

What's good for the goose is good for the gander, you can't change half way through a period of making 'rules' and when the finnished result doesn't pan out for your side then throw a tantrum and then change them.

You have short memories guy's

Wut??

 

[Sonic Kiwi]

uh what?

What I'm saying is that after reading through this post is that majical word "transformation" pops up time and time again.

Throughout AB and Bok history, the Bok Govt/management used "honourable" status for some and not so for others.

HM is in a pickle

 

[WaterboySA]

You have no idea what you're talking about, said with no disrespect. I'm not complaining about who can play, I want the team to be chosen on merit. If there is 15 black guys that's the best in their positions the whole team must be black.

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You have no idea what you're talking about, said with no disrespect. I'm not complaining about who can play, I want the team to be chosen on merit. If there is 15 black guys that's the best in their positions the whole team must be black.

I take that back. You must be drunk, I'm dumbstruck.

 

[TheOvalBall]

To be honest I find all this cynicism about our country to be very wearying. In the end we don't have a quota system in rugby and I don't think we will in the near future. The 50% goal is just that a goal not enforceable policy and since roughly 30% of our squad were people of colour this year 50% isn't that far off, especially since I think a lesser number will be accepted closer to the world cup. Anyone who says we didn't win this world cup because of political interference is talking utter nonsense, we lost for many reasons and if racial quotas was one of those reasons it was a very very small one.
Also the number of quality black players should continue to increase as inequality in the country evens out, so I think we can probably find ourselves in a place where we are only slightly weakened by quota goals.

As for Heineke Meyer, I've come to the decision that I'd be happy with him having another four years, partly because I think it takes more than 4 years to build a championship team and partly because I don't see many other options. I did recently read an article that claimed HM said we don't have the requisite skills to play an expansive game, and if true I'd rather Heineke does get fired, I'm inclined to think the article is ,making stuff up though, what do you guys think? Heinken you generally have good bull#### spotting abilities: http://www.sport24.co.za/Rugby/WorldCup/Meyer-Boks-have-no-skills-20151103

The problem is the government always picks on rugby, yet turns a blind eye to soccer, which has a massive black following, and the worst off in terms of demographical representation.

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What I'm saying is that after reading through this post is that majical word "transformation" pops up time and time again.

Throughout AB and Bok history, the Bok Govt/management used "honourable" status for some and not so for others.

HM is in a pickle

Government interference is the problem. Would you like your sports minister to tell Steve Hansen on a constant basis, that he needs to pick players that are not there on merit ?

 

[TRF_stormer2010]

uh what?

Wut??

Why did you have to go and quote that guy? Now his post shows up on my feed. Just let his clumsy rambling attempts at trolling slide.

 

[Sonic Kiwi]

The problem is the government always picks on rugby, yet turns a blind eye to soccer, which has a massive black following, and the worst off in terms of demographical representation.

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Government interference is the problem. Would you like your sports minister to tell Steve Hansen on a constant basis, that he needs to pick players that are not there on merit ?

How long has your Govt picked on sport especially considering who should and shouldn't play for the Boks?

Personally I think HM has an ideal situation to stay as Bok coach especially after his old mates eg Matfield, FDP etc have left. HM has a fantastic young group of players that have BMT eg De Allende, Pollard etc that have experience and young enough to play in the next RWC.

Fans talk about peaking, HM and his new found youthful team could peak in 2 yrs and if not in 4 yrs time.

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Why did you have to go and quote that guy? Now his post shows up on my feed. Just let his clumsy rambling attempts at trolling slide.

Is that directed at me Stormer?

 

[mdaclarke]

I don't know what has gone on in the past in South Africa. All I know is that a rugby fan I want to see National Teams picked on merit and merit alone. An eye for an eye makes the world blind to quote Ghandi I believe.

 

[Canuck]

HOOKER
Inside track:
Adriaan Strauss -
Bismarck du Plessis - I can see him staying around the Bok fold despite being in France by dit of the fact that our other options will be needing time and experience at SR leve first and Brits and Burden are also old and in Europe.
Maybe:
Scarra Ntubeni - has been groomed for a spot and is probably still in contention but has failed IMO to get enough consistency in his core duties to warrant selection for the Stormers nevermind the Bokke....

Nizaam Carr -
Youngster who could step up:
Where do I start.. TBH I don't think anyone below these above will get a look in soon; we are just too well stocked here.

I think there's a couple young back row players that could feature for the Boks in a few years and play a big role in 2019. Sikhumbuso Notshe and Hanro Liebenberg. Liebenberg has all the tools to be our No. 8 of the future and Notshe is an explosive athlete, fantastic with ball in hand and is making strides every season. The fact that he would help fill the quota is also a factor even though perhaps it shouldn't be.

At hooker Ntubeni seems to have been given alot of attention as a future Bok but personally I rate Bongi Mbonambi's performance this year as better. They're both the same age so it's not like Ntubeni has an edge there either. Young Joseph Dweba also shows promise.

We should be able to enjoy continuity at 10-12-13 going forward with Lambie/Pollard/De Allende/Kriel and Serfontein. Add to that other young guys like Elton Jantjies, Robert du Preez and Harold Vorster and things look promising there.

At scrum-half things look really interesting. Du Preez is probably gone and IMO Pienaar should be as well. Paige barely got blooded at all during the WC so we don't really know what he can do yet. I'd love to see Paige get more of a chance going forward, but also want to see Faf de Klerk get a shot as well. Reinach I assume will be back in the mix as well (I thought he should have been in the squad instead of Pienaar). For 2019 though I could see Stefan Ungerer featuring as well, he's got future Bok written all over him.

Our back three might be totally revamped for 2019. It's unlikely that Habana, JP or Mvovo will have any role then given that they will be 36, 33 and 33 at the time. I personally am not a big fan of Cornal Hendricks and while Le Roux should still be the full back going for the near future he certainly doesn't have the jersey locked up.

Wingers like Senatla, Sergeal Petersen and Dillyn Leyds have speed to burn but are pretty undersized for Intl level (although that certainly hasn't affected Santiago Cordero). I could see one of those guys stepping up in the next few years but we probably won't have a lineup with multiple small wingers who can be a liability on defense. I could see more solid wingers like Luther Obi and Leolin Zas getting to play in 2 or 3 years. And my dark horse on the wing is Wandile Mjekevu, who has great size and talent. He showed alot of promise years ago, fizzled a bit but moved to France where he has developed before coming back to SA.

I've already earmarked Warrick Gelant as a future Bok in the backline too.

 

[mdaclarke]

One thing that did make me chuckle was the threat to withdraw government funding. It is my understanding (I stand to be corrected) that the SARU is completely self funding, so if there was any transfer of funds it is certainly not going from the Government to SARU

 

[The Jones Boy]

South Africa need to start playing a sniffer like Brussow. He is a cracking player and i can't believe he wasn't a shoe in for the BOks over the last 8 years, the guy has no sense of self preservation and throws himself into the danger area overtime. He's a quality proper actual open side flanker in the Kiwi or Aussie mould.
I thought the Boks were at their most dangerous when Broussow was playing.
Without a proper sniffer like McCaw or Hopper the Boks have relied on big oafs to try and get them through and it is hampering their efforts at the breakdown. The model of three Bull elephants in the back row is not a template that has brought any tangible results for the Boks. They desperately need a sniffer so they can compete at the breakdown.