The Lions squad for 2021 prediction

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

We will all see Gatlands bias when he chooses less England players than the previous 5th Wales and Ireland....although if he did pick a lot of England players even in their poor form he'd be called a bad selector.

Bit of a lose lose situation for Gatland really.

 

[ncurd]

We will all see Gatlands bias when he chooses less England players than the previous 5th Wales and Ireland....although if he did pick a lot of England players even in their poor form he'd be called a bad selector.

Bit of a lose lose situation for Gatland really.

Honestly smaller squad this time around. I think he has to take Itoje, Curry and Watson. Farrells a given but shouldn't be there.

Then it's who are the outliers. You'd think Sinckler, George, ?Marler?, ?Kruis?, Underhill and May.

You look at England and expect a smaller contingent.

The reason why its lose/lose is he should be picking less England players. If he does the question is why did he select poor form players on previous tours. If he does select them why is he doing it again?

 

[Welsh Exile]

Have a look at the breakdown, by nationality, of lions tours going back to the 90s. You'll see that it hasn't changed that much.

 

[Welsh Exile]

Honestly smaller squad this time around. I think he has to take Itoje, Curry and Watson. Farrells a given but shouldn't be there.

Then it's who are the outliers. You'd think Sinckler, George, ?Marler?, ?Kruis?, Underhill and May.

You look at England and expect a smaller contingent.

The reason why its lose/lose is he should be picking less England players. If he does the question is why did he select poor form players on previous tours. If he does select them why is he doing it again?

He picks players he rates/likes. There's no need to over complicate things. This weird conspiracy style thinking is baffling. The idea that Gatland sits at home and thinks to himself what inferior Welsh players can I take over better English ones is a bit weird.

 

[ncurd]

He picks players he rates/likes.

Yeah that's bias whether justified or not and to suggest any selector is not bring in any bias decision making process is frankly a little naive.

You are right there is no massive conspiracy Gatland rates the players he's worked with more than the ones he hasn't. So picks them when there isn't a clearly better candidate. It's why a national coach shouldn't be the Lions coach.

 

[Welsh Exile]

Also you guys can't have it both ways. 2 of the biggest falsehoods I see on here are:

A) Gatland favours poor Welsh players over better English and Irish ones for Lions

B) Gatland likes big strong players only.

So which is it?

 

[Welsh Exile]

Yeah that's bias whether justified or not and to suggest any selector is not bring in any bias decision making process is frankly a little naive.

You are right there is no massive conspiracy Gatland rates the players he's worked with more than the ones he hasn't. So picks them when there isn't a clearly better candidate. It's why a national coach shouldn't be the Lions coach.

Well yeah, obviously, but the insinuation is that this Opinion is based largely on nationality. That's the conspiracy BS

Clearly he has his own opinions. As I've said a million times it's all just opinions. But you guys aren't saying that, you're saying he's picking poor players over better ones coz he loves the Welsh which is kinda funny.

If people just said "well I disagree with that pick as I think such and such is better" fine that great but that's not the insinuation. If I've got that wrong fair enough.

 

[Welsh Exile]

We will all see Gatlands bias when he chooses less England players than the previous 5th Wales and Ireland....although if he did pick a lot of England players even in their poor form he'd be called a bad selector.

Bit of a lose lose situation for Gatland really.

Can you, in your opinion, give me a breakdown of all the outrageous selection decisions Gatland has made for the match day 23s on his lions tours?

 

[ncurd]

Well yeah, obviously, but the insinuation is that this Opinion is based largely on nationality. That's the conspiracy BS

Clearly he has his own opinions. As I've said a million times it's all just opinions. But you guys aren't saying that, you're saying he's picking poor players over better ones coz he loves the Welsh which is kinda funny.

If people just said "well I disagree with that pick as I think such and such is better" fine that great but that's not the insinuation. If I've got that wrong fair enough.

I think your conflating he picks the Welsh players because loves Wales and he picks the Welsh players because he (was) the recent Welsh Coach.

 

[Welsh Exile]

I think your conflating he picks the Welsh players because loves Wales and he picks the Welsh players because he (was) the recent Welsh Coach.

What this comes down to, is that there's a lot of English people who simply can't handle the fact that players who, in their opinion are better, are overlooked by Gatland. They can't handle that someone might disagree and think differently. Sure, Gatland has more info about Welsh players than he does English and that will certainly play into the committees decision but to suggest that, in any way, Gatland has nationality in his thinking when making that decision is laughable. He picks players he thinks are best. You may disagree, I know I've disagreed with him many times before, but like arseholes, we all have them.

 

[Umaga's Witness]

I have a question, what happens when players get injured? Will there be a long quarantine period for a replacement? If so, the squad is going to need a number of players who can play multiple positions. What props can play either side for instance? Can any these days?

 

[ncurd]

I have a question, what happens when players get injured? Will there be a long quarantine period for a replacement? If so, the squad is going to need a number of players who can play multiple positions. What props can play either side for instance? Can any these days?

I'd be more worried about a COVID outbreak within the team of I'm honest. I think injuries will mostly be handled by reserves taking regular tests beforehand anyway, following their bubble rules for playing at the moment. And a minimal quarantine period.

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

What this comes down to, is that there's a lot of English people who simply can't handle the fact that players who, in their opinion are better, are overlooked by Gatland. They can't handle that someone might disagree and think differently. Sure, Gatland has more info about Welsh players than he does English and that will certainly play into the committees decision but to suggest that, in any way, Gatland has nationality in his thinking when making that decision is laughable. He picks players he thinks are best. You may disagree, I know I've disagreed with him many times before, but like arseholes, we all have them.

If youve been on here a long time I think you would know that English fans usually moan mostly about the lack of Scottish and Irish players over welsh ones. There's the odd few English players (like launchbury) but in general he takes lots of welsh irrespective of their form or how good they are as an actual player.

He is picking players he knows can do a job and he knows he can work with which I get but it is bias. It doesn't make you any less welsh to admit that.

 

[TRF_heineken]

Have a look at the breakdown, by nationality, of lions tours going back to the 90s. You'll see that it hasn't changed that much.

Maybe a bit of introspection is then needed here...

Since the 90's the B&I Lions was only coached once by an English coach, and that was Sir Clive Woodward in 2005 (who had won the World Cup in 2003).

It's not like the guys making the player selections are playing favourites towards England. Apart from Woodward, every other coach of the Lions coached one of the other home nations. So you can understand that from an outsider's perspective this repeated bashing of English players being selected ahead of others for silly reasons other than rugby related reasons, doesn't make sense at all.

Without taking any consideration of the 6 Nations this year, England should have a lot of their players selected. Same goes for Wales. It's no fluke that they both ended up in the top 4 of the World Cup.

 

[Welsh Exile]

If youve been on here a long time I think you would know that English fans usually moan mostly about the lack of Scottish and Irish players over welsh ones. There's the odd few English players (like launchbury) but in general he takes lots of welsh irrespective of their form or how good they are as an actual player.

He is picking players he knows can do a job and he knows he can work with which I get but it is bias. It doesn't make you any less welsh to admit that.

Ok, so you admit he picks players he thinks are better to do a certain job?

Basically, why do you think he picks Welsh players over players from other countries you think are better. What's his motivation?

If your answer is, what it was just now (he picks players he knows can do a job) fine, no argument. If your answer is that it's based on nationality and he'd rather go for a weaker player he knows over a better player he knows less, then that's where we disagree.

 

[Welsh Exile]

Maybe a bit of introspection is then needed here...

Since the 90's the B&I Lions was only coached once by an English coach, and that was Sir Clive Woodward in 2005 (who had won the World Cup in 2003).

It's not like the guys making the player selections are playing favourites towards England. Apart from Woodward, every other coach of the Lions coached one of the other home nations. So you can understand that from an outsider's perspective this repeated bashing of English players being selected ahead of others for silly reasons other than rugby related reasons, doesn't make sense at all.

Without taking any consideration of the 6 Nations this year, England should have a lot of their players selected. Same goes for Wales. It's no fluke that they both ended up in the top 4 of the World Cup.

This tour will be no different to the last 7 or 8 tours. The split between Welsh, English and Irish won't be all that big.

 

[Welsh Exile]

Also, as a final point. I can guarantee you that Gatland knows every single English player a lot better than any single English fan. The info he'll have on all players will far exceed anything even the biggest English rugby naus fan will know.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Gatland has zero bias towards Welsh players guys
He only calls up the best welsh players like Cory Hill and Kristian Dacey

 

[Welsh Exile]

Gatland has zero bias towards Welsh players guys
He only calls up the best welsh players like Cory Hill and Kristian Dacey

I knew the Geography 6 or whatever they were called would be brought up. To be fair, I'm talking about initial squad selections, I.e who was originally selected but in fairness Gatland has, quite recently, spoken about this and admitted he made a mistake there. Remind me, how much test rugby did they play?

 

[TRF_Olyy]

I have a question, what happens when players get injured? Will there be a long quarantine period for a replacement? If so, the squad is going to need a number of players who can play multiple positions. What props can play either side for instance? Can any these days?

The only top level prop I can think of is Joe Market theoretically can cover tighthead in an emergency (I think he was named as a utility prop in the world cup? Or maybe last lions tour? Can't remember which) but I'm not sure he ever played there

As mentioned above: the Lions have asked a number of players to basically quarantine at home for the duration of the tour so they can fly in if there's injuries - though that'll go out the window if SA implement a quarantine as you enter the country (I'm guessing there isn't one atm? Not sure)



Edit: Porter plays tighthead and loosehead, I think, as well