The relegation run-in

[Patchey]

They already have a very good tram for the Championship. And signing Mike Blair is a very decent start for them in the transfer market. Could do with a boost in the outside backs and the back row though. Joel Hodgson looks a decent prospect at 10.

To be honest, with the Championship strengthening I really think that the Premiership should have 2 teams go up and down like they do in the Top 14. Would add excitement to both leagues, and end the farce of a side who has been top of the league all year playing knockout matches.

But that would require some form of common sense from the top brass...

If Bedford had the right stadium requirements to go up I'd love to see them play in the Premiership. Bedford is, in case you didn't know, one of the few towns in the UK without a proper football team and as such the rugby club is the town's main sports club. Instead of half filled stadiums for Newcastle or Oxford Welsh games you'd get a full house.

Back in the realms of reality, Welsh could realistically get some points today. Northampton can't be feeling great after their drubbing last time out. Even so if Sale play even half as well as they did against Glos for the rest of the season Welsh aren't going to catch them and will just have to hope a non-eligible team wins the Championship.

 

[Howzy]

They already have a very good tram for the Championship. And signing Mike Blair is a very decent start for them in the transfer market. Could do with a boost in the outside backs and the back row though. Joel Hodgson looks a decent prospect at 10.

To be honest, with the Championship strengthening I really think that the Premiership should have 2 teams go up and down like they do in the Top 14. Would add excitement to both leagues, and end the farce of a side who has been top of the league all year playing knockout matches.

Even if two teams did go up there still would be the fact that one of the teams wouldn't be Eliagble for promoting as they don't meet rfu regulations. It would be even worse if there was two teams at the top which couldn't go up if most if the top flight teams within the championship had the regulation facilities maybe this would be a good idea

 

[Draggs]

London Welsh will be relegated, having lost 14-31 to Northampton.

 

[LittleGuy]

London Welsh will be relegated, having lost 14-31 to Northampton.

Yeah barring something bizarre happening, as I said yesterday I beleive the only Championship team still in contention that can't be promoted as of now are Bedford. So Welsh fans will have to put their Blues hats on then hope Bedford dosen't find/upgrade a ground even if they do win. Either way not looking good and even without the 5 point loss they would have been 7 back at the end of today and stil would have been in a heap of trouble.

 

[Howzy]

London Welsh will be relegated, having lost 14-31 to Northampton.

Well that means welsh wont be on rugby challenge 2

 

[McTallshort]

Wonder what will happen to Welsh? will they move back to Deer park or stay in Oxford. Got to take on some good championship teams next year to get back up again. I didnt think having another London based franchise without a ground was a good thing for the Premiership but I was wrong we need some new clubs coming up into the AP lets hope its Nottingham next year....

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Saw on twitter that their main investor is pulling out, so they're in the sh*t basically.

 

[Tony Manx]

Saw on twitter that their main investor is pulling out, so they're in the sh*t basically.

Maybe they will get some "Brains"....................

 

[ratsapprentice]

Having another "London" team in the premiership is completely pointless.

It was inevitable that they were gonna go down, you know it's true when the club themselves have no plan for promotion.
Their lack of depth was always going to tell, however good their early performances were.
I don't really have much "sympathy" for them, I don't think they really deserved to be promoted.
Regardless of them winning the championship final. I don't really see what they bring to the tournament.
Nothing personal though.

I think Newcastle winning their place back will be very good for Union in this country, especially as they have Dean Richards in charge.
Hopefully they can make some good signings.
Anyone know what their academy set-up is like?

 

[Patchey]

Having another "London" team in the premiership is completely pointless.

It was inevitable that they were gonna go down, you know it's true when the club themselves have no plan for promotion.
Their lack of depth was always going to tell, however good their early performances were.
I don't really have much "sympathy" for them, I don't think they really deserved to be promoted.
Regardless of them winning the championship final. I don't really see what they bring to the tournament.
Nothing personal though.

I think Newcastle winning their place back will be very good for Union in this country, especially as they have Dean Richards in charge.
Hopefully they can make some good signings.
Anyone know what their academy set-up is like?

I don't think it wasn't so much as not having a plan as not being able to implement it until it was too late to pick up enough Premiership quality players. The ridiculous length of the Championship play off nightmare and ensuing appeal meant that by the time they knew they were going to be promoted Gavin Henson was the best they could do (incidentally, where has old tantastic been these last few weeks?). Welsh could have spent beforehand and hoped the appeal would succeed but had they failed would have faced a massive shortfall as happened to Bristol (which was pointed out earlier).

Also, while I get the point about another London club not really being useful I don't think you can say they didn't deserve to be promoted. They won the final and were therefore the best team in the Championship last year while Newcastle were the worse in the Premiership. That should be the only criteria for promotion and relegation otherwise you end up with an even more farcical system, the relegation of the Lions from Super Rugby and promotion of the Southern Kinds being an example (although at this rate the Kings will finish about the Highlanders and I will have to eat my words...).

 

[Howzy]

Having another "London" team in the premiership is completely pointless.

It was inevitable that they were gonna go down, you know it's true when the club themselves have no plan for promotion.
Their lack of depth was always going to tell, however good their early performances were.
I don't really have much "sympathy" for them, I don't think they really deserved to be promoted.
Regardless of them winning the championship final. I don't really see what they bring to the tournament.
Nothing personal though.

I think Newcastle winning their place back will be very good for Union in this country, especially as they have Dean Richards in charge.
Hopefully they can make some good signings.
Anyone know what their academy set-up is like?

Totally agree with the signings of players as they have lost gopperth and Hudson. There academy is ok Theres about 5 academy players who have commited there future to the falcons

 

[ratsapprentice]

The hold up by the RFU when they won the final is irrelevant. Just compare their situation with the one Exeter are in.
Exeter hit the ground running because they were targeting an immediate promotion, and they survived.

I don't think play-offs are appropriate for the championship because it leaves us in the situation we are in now, teams being promoted prematurely, just to be shat back out again.
Especially given how little support the promoted teams are given, they need to have invested in proper infrastructure, they can't do that in one off-season.
Just as Andy Robinson was saying last week, even if Bristol won the Championship, he wouldn't like to go up because they aren't ready for it.
The problem is that not all of the clubs are actually aiming for promotion in the short-term, which leaves them ****ed if they happen to win it.

 

[Patchey]

Agreed that the play offs, especially the two leg format, are not needed. But there is nothing to be done if a team wins the league without, as you say, being ready for it. There is a Bristol could get promoted unless Robinson tell them to play to lose. I wouldn't be ideal for them or for competition in the Premiership but they'd still deserve to be there if they did get promoted (more so if there weren't play offs).

As for Newcastle's academy, this is the club the helped to produce Wilkinson, Flood and Tait so if they still have a similar structure/personnel there, They've signed Mike Blair as well I think.

 

[ratsapprentice]

I don't think they'd deserve to be there at all. Promotion/relegation is designed to increase competition in the Premiership.
The idea being that the team most capable of performing in the premiership is promoted, I can't understand how you can claim to be in that position unless you are top of the league, let alone FOURTH(!), as LW were.

 

[Patchey]

But they were the only team that made it through the play-offs. As it stands all the Championship teams know that to get promoted they'll have to deal with the play-offs whether they've been top all season or just snuck into the final play-off berth. While whoever finished first last season (can't remember off the top of my head) by have been the most consistent Championship side they still failed to clear the final hurdle. I'm not trying to defend the play-off system but in my mind whoever does come out on top will be the team who deserve promotion, having been the ones to 'beat the system' so to speak.

The same applied, incidentally, to the Premiership title and its, admittedly more even handed play-off system. When Saracens one they weren't the most exciting team, didn't finish top and certainly didn't play the 'best; rugby but they did play in a way that made them hard to beat and got them into and won a final.

 

[BRSTLDRGN]

Saw on twitter that their main investor is pulling out, so they're in the sh*t basically.

Sounds like he threw a hissy fit saying the RFU never wanted LW promoted in the first place and were just looking for an excuse to get rid of them.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Sounds like he threw a hissy fit saying the RFU never wanted LW promoted in the first place and were just looking for an excuse to get rid of them.

Aye.
I imagine he's also had a memo from his accountant telling him how much of a money-blackhole investing in a rugby side is.

 

[BRSTLDRGN]

Aye.
I imagine he's also had a memo from his accountant telling him how much of a money-blackhole investing in a rugby side is.

Frankly if someone is going to withdraw funding just because the side got relegated I think LW are better without someone who only cares about the club in the top flight only.

 

[ratsapprentice]

I'm not trying to defend the play-off system but in my mind whoever does come out on top will be the team who deserve promotion, having been the ones to 'beat the system' so to speak.

That's exactly why it's inappropriate though... because it does not necessarily promote the team best equipped to survive (that being the team that can place highly in a league structure).
It doesn't matter in the premiership, because the cycle just starts again.
Play-offs might make the championship more exciting, but they also potentially reduce the competitiveness of the premiership.
Something that the premiership does not even need to consider.
Being able to win finals is not something that teams that are (realistically) going to be tasked with if they win promotion.
Whereas being competitive in a league is, that's why the No.1 team is most deserving.

 

[McTallshort]

That's exactly why it's inappropriate though... because it does not necessarily promote the team best equipped to survive (that being the team that can place highly in a league structure).
It doesn't matter in the premiership, because the cycle just starts again.
Play-offs might make the championship more exciting, but they also potentially reduce the competitiveness of the premiership.
Something that the premiership does not even need to consider.
Being able to win finals is not something that teams that are (realistically) going to be tasked with if they win promotion.
Whereas being competitive in a league is, that's why the No.1 team is most deserving.

Which is why we had the promotion criteria and a reason why I didnt want London welsh promoted last season but looking back I was wrong because why have rules for clubs looking for promotion but not enforce those rules for clubs like Wasps, L Irish and back then Sale and Sarries too? Plus Newcastle had been Sh*t for many seasons and deserved to drop.