[2015 Six Nations] England

[Raggs]

Still think Robson will be our long term scrum half. Really has it all, good pass, good break and very accurate kicking game.

 

[RedruthRFC]

Yeandle doesn't seem to be on the radar at the moment, but he should be - he throws accurately, makes tackles and is a decent ball carrier.

Well said. I made the point before the Six Nations (possibly in this thread) that I don't understand why there is so much buzz about LCD and little or none about Yeandle. Before his injury this season he was starting ahead of LCD and captaining Chiefs on occasion. His set pieces are certainly better and he's an excellent ball carrier. The only area where I can see that there could be cause for concern is work rate (he's a big unit), but I don't get to watch enough Chiefs games to comment. Both are products of the Chiefs academy and I imagine buy into the strong Chiefs ethos and love the club and are loyal to it, however from the point of view of both players' development, I can't help thinking that it would be better if one went elsewhere.

 

[RedruthRFC]

If Nowell is still in the team then, I hope he will have learnt how to pass to supporting players. I don't think hes a bad player, but at the moment hes nowhere near as clinical as Joseph or Wade when it comes to taking chances.

For fear of blowing smoke up a certain body part, well said again. I'm probably the biggest Nowell fan boy on the forum having watched him play for my club as a seventeen year old (him not me!) and followed his career with great interest. Obviously he is still young and hopefully will improve, but trying to remain objective, he is now playing in his second Six Nations tournament and still has some pretty glaring weaknesses. Harsh as it may be, I think he's part of an ever increasing crop of players who are weak in the top 6 inches.

His England future could be determined by where Exeter see his future with the club.

 

[msf]

Yeandle's work rate is actually really good, comparable to Youngs or LCDs. He might be slightly less explosive than those two, but as you said, he is a big unit (a positive for a front rower) and he can throw.

 

[Wendigo7]

World Cup Side:

1. Marler
2. Hartley
3. Cole
4. Launchbury
5. Lawes
6. Haskell
7. Robshaw (c)
8. Vunipola
9. Youngs
10. Ford
11. Nowell
12. Tuilagi
13. Joseph
14. Watson
15. Brown

Subs:
16. Vunipola
17. Brookes
18. Youngs
19. Attwood
20. Morgan
21. Wigglesworth
22. Farrell
23. Slade

Unused 8 Reserves:
24. Corbisiero
25. Wilson
26. Webber
27. Wood
28. Easter
29. Care
30. Twelvetrees
31. Cipriani

 

[chippieolamus]

World Cup Side:

1. Marler
2. Hartley
3. Cole
4. Launchbury
5. Lawes
6. Haskell
7. Robshaw (c)
8. Morgan
9. Youngs
10. Ford
11. Nowell
12. Tuilagi
13. Joseph
14. Watson
15. Brown

Subs:
16. Youngs
17. Vunipola
18. Wilson
19. Attwood
20. Vunipola
21. Wigglesworth
22. Slade
23. May

Unused 8 Reserves:
24. Corbisiero
25. Brookes
26. Webber
27. Wood
28. Parling
29. Care
30. Twelvetrees
31. Cipriani/Farrell

Pretty much. I think Corbs will walk into the starting spot if he shows his pre-injury form, if not then you're about right. My changes are in bold.

 

[Wendigo7]

We're still very capable of winning the whole thing.

I don't like being negative about side even though I'm aware of it's faults.

Were a cohesive defensive structure that suits the team away from being a top class outfit to match anyone.

 

[Tony Manx]

Pretty much. I think Corbs will walk into the starting spot if he shows his pre-injury form, if not then you're about right. My changes are in bold.

Surely the last time Corbs showed form was the Lions tour?

Can Lancaster really, really take a gamble on his or Manu's fitness after the last 12 months?

Are they really that much of stand out players that demand that Lancaster takes such a gamble?

I just do not believe it!!!

 

[chippieolamus]

Surely the last time Corbs showed form was the Lions tour?

Sorry that's what I meant, before his injury soon after the lions

 

[Peat]

Surely the last time Corbs showed form was the Lions tour?

Can Lancaster really, really take a gamble on his or Manu's fitness after the last 12 months?

Are they really that much of stand out players that demand that Lancaster takes such a gamble?

I just do not believe it!!!

Corbs' international form, as when last seen two years ago, trounces anything seen from an English loosehead - or virtually any other loosehead - seen since imo. He finds that form and he walks in straight past Marler and I would gamble on him finding that form. But then I really don't rate Marler's contribution at international level and would seriously consider Vunipola ahead of Marler.

Equally, Tuilagi's best is as good as it gets for me. I can't be quite as effusive as he still has some rough spots in his play, but I'd gamble on him as well at 12. His physicality is insane and we don't really have an outstanding 12 available. If Joseph gets injured I'd definitely gamble on him at 13.

In short, yes, I consider both to be outstanding options for this England team, which isn't necessarily a huge compliment...

 

[j'nuh]

Corbs' international form, as when last seen two years ago, trounces anything seen from an English loosehead - or virtually any other loosehead - seen since imo. He finds that form and he walks in straight past Marler and I would gamble on him finding that form. But then I really don't rate Marler's contribution at international level and would seriously consider Vunipola ahead of Marler.

I'm still undecided on the thought of whether Corbs' will be that good again. I've said this before, but I'm still not certain whether the scrummaging changes (introduced after the Lions) have played into Corbs' hands. I think removing the hit has made scrum dominance much less likely; it will only happen when there is a big mismatch in ability between the props, and it won't result in the torrent of penalties it used to. Take that away from the Corbs' of two years ago, and he isn't that remarkable.

 

[TommiG88]

Just a mention, how crucial that disallowed try against Ireland became. I was adamant it wasn't a forward pass, not even close too.

I know we also left points out there against wales and Scotland. But I just feel we lacked a bit of luck this 6 nations.

O well; bring on the World Cup.

 

[Peat]

I'm still undecided on the thought of whether Corbs' will be that good again. I've said this before, but I'm still not certain whether the scrummaging changes (introduced after the Lions) have played into Corbs' hands. I think removing the hit has made scrum dominance much less likely; it will only happen when there is a big mismatch in ability between the props, and it won't result in the torrent of penalties it used to. Take that away from the Corbs' of two years ago, and he isn't that remarkable.

Taking away the days where he utterly minced lesser props and you are still left with a loosehead who will virtually never get into trouble in the scrum, is very industrious at hitting the breakdown, accurate and industrious in defence, and who carries strongly.

And if that's not actually very remarkable for a loosehead prop in international rugby in this day and age, I'm not sure we're watching the same game. There's not many players out there that can boast that combination of traits and none of the others are English. If Corbs retains all of that entirely, he will still be one of the best looseheads in his generation. If his scrummaging drops a little, and is only as effective as Marler's now, he will still comfortably be the best English prop available until Vunipola improves his scrummaging.

 

[msf]

I promised I wouldn't be negative about England this week, so I will point out the competition we have in each position rather than the fact that the wings, centres and back row as still up for grabs.

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And possibly the front row too.

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Plus the second row and the half backs...but Mike Brown will definitely play!

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I think this will be the thing that tells against us in the world cup, not the caliber of players or even the coaching. I think the best a unsettled side has done at a World Cup is make the final in 2007 and 2011, so I guess there's hope, but neither of those achievements kept the coaches their jobs for very long...

 

[Maverick1987]

I promised I wouldn't be negative about England this week, so I will point out the competition we have in each position rather than the fact that the wings, centres and back row as still up for grabs.

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And possibly the front row too.

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Plus the second row and the half backs...but Mike Brown will definitely play!

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I think this will be the thing that tells against us in the world cup, not the caliber of players or even the coaching. I think the best a unsettled side has done at a World Cup is make the final in 2007 and 2011, so I guess there's hope, but neither of those achievements kept the coaches their jobs for very long...

I thought the wings were ok . Outside centre was fine . Back row ? I suspect they will just go back to wood . Anyone else think we were ridiculously slow to the breakdown at times ? The front row is a like for like imo . We have 6 high quality players across the prop positions pick 4 and go with it . Hooker well it's either Hartley or Youngs not that difficult . Second row is Lawes and Launchbury when fit . Half back is one of the pairings along with SR that picks itself imo

I think you're being a bit doom and gloom tbh

 

[Mrs. Peter Quinn]

Anyone else still angry at Haskell? Can.not.be.trusted

 

[TheSaffycen]

Right this would be my ratings for the main 15 over the whole 6 nations
1-Marler 7 He was very strong in both the set piece and the loose. The Scotland game I think was just a poor reffing performance in the scrum.
2-Harltey 5 He done nothing in the loose and then his throwing went off the boil. He's lucky to get the 5.
3-Cole 8.5 He was great in the scrum, brilliant over the ball and he went through a ton of work. He is a genuine world class player.
4-Lawes 8.5 In just two games he showed how much we missed him. Robshaw's lack of pace to pressure the fly half doesn't matter when he's there.
5-Attwood 6 He didn't make the impact required, I still want him too be used though but if we only take 4 locks to the world cup Kruis will be hot on his heels.
6-Haskell 6 Again not what I wanted too see, also gave away stupid penalties.
7-Robshaw 7.5 Made loads of tackles (82) I think he leads the team well and too me he is still worth his place.
8-Vunipola 8.5 He carried, tackled and just kept going. Feel terrible for Morgan but this was a great tournament for Billy who can hopefully make the 8 shirt his.
9-Youngs 8 After a rather average Italy game he was brilliant and he looked to just grow into the tournament and his partnership with Ford looks strong.
10-Ford 8.5 Has 7 try assist, 2 tries and was top points scorer with 75. He looks very dangerous with the ball in hand, see what he can do with Manu outside him.
11-Nowell 7.5 Made 326m beat 16 defenders and scored tries.
12-Burrell 6 Again he didn't play as well as he could've. He looks better at 13 but isn't good enough to move JJ or a fit Manu. Might play well at 13 with a distributor inside him.
13-JJ 9 He was the big spark for us moving from a team that's attack pretty much only comes from the 15 running down the 13 channel to a running flowing game that has a 13 who sets up tries and is also a finisher.
14-Watson 6.5 Really steady and when given space is a dangerous player, also very good under the high ball meaning we look more secure than in the past. Needs to look for support more when he makes a break.
15-Brown 7 When he plays we have a real threat when the ball is kicked deep to us. Brown-Watson-Nowell are all safe under the high ball and a threat when running.
So my team going forward would be
1.Corbisiero 2.Youngs 3.Cole 4.Lawes 5.Launchbury 6.Robshaw (C) 7.Kvesic 8.Vunipola 9.Youngs 10.Ford 11.Nowell 12.Manu 13.Joseph 14.Watson 15.Brown

 

[yaboyjj]

I think the position that must be freshened up in the warm up's is hooker, Hartley was rubbish, but England lost 2 lineouts while Youngs was on the field- they were in crucial positions too (I get the feeling he needs to be babysat by a full compliment of Lawes/Parling/Wood as jumpers, and that cannot be guaranteed). I still think George could be the answer.

I believe England have warm up matches against Ireland, France and USA?
there are opportunities to try out 2, maybe 3 new players here, whilst also trying to bed in some combinations like Youngs/Ford or Tuilagi/Joseph? (but also wrapping a couple of key players in cotton wool ie not playing the likes of Robshaw too much)

Maybe something like:
Corbs, George, Cole, Lawes, Kruis, Kvesic, Wood, Vunipola, Youngs, Ford, Nowell, Tuilagi, Joseph, Watson, Brown
or
Marler, George, Cole, Lawes, Launchbury, Robshaw, Ewers, Vunipola, Youngs, Ford, Nowell, Hill, Joseph, Wade, Brown

so maybe drip feeding in a couple of outsiders into the team in a couple of the iffy positions, notably: Hill/Tuilagi/Slade at 12, George at 2, Ewers/Kvesic/Itoje at 6 and Wade/Roko/May at wing. I think 2 and 6 are the positions most likely to see bolters.

 

[Mrs. Peter Quinn]

Ewers is the answer at 6.
Cowan-Dickie or Webber at 2
Manu at 12.

Bring back Morgan
Bring back Corbs - god knows we better get the most out of him before he gets crocked again
Bring back Launchbury

Do that and job's a good un'***

***By which I mean we will shaft the world by how great we are

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Anyone else still angry at Haskell? Can.not.be.trusted

Yup, it was just so stupid.
There was really no need - it wasn't a "3pts rather than 7" situation, where he's stopped a try, he just saw the guy running so slid for him.