Australia vs England - 3 Tests - June 2016

[Vieux Talonneur]

The calls to drop Joseph are slightly alarming. He might not have done anything "wonderful", but he's not done much wrong.

He's won England Player of the Year and Player's Player of the Year in the 2014/15 season, has scored 8 tries in 22 tests, made zero notable mistakes and isn't even in bad form atm. Consistency is key, and dropping Joseph for a player with a fraction of the experience and equal form is a poor decision in my book.

Especially if there are likely to be changes at 10 and 12 inside him.

Daly reminds me of Simpson a bit. Eye catching when the after burners are on, but sometimes barely noticeable. I would be tempted to have a very serious look though if he starts goal kicking regularly.

 

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

1. Back Row
2. SH
3. IC
4. FB

All far, far more pressing issues.

Really, Fullback? I can't see Brown being phased out until after the Lions tour. I'd say it's a far more looming issue that after Faz and Ford we don't really have a contendable 10.

 

[Peat]

1. Back Row
2. SH
3. IC
4. FB

All far, far more pressing issues.

Not too happy with the front either tbh, now that you mention this sort of thing...

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

1. Back Row
2. SH
3. IC
4. FB

All far, far more pressing issues.

In fact pretty much everything bar lock.

 

[ratsapprentice]

Not too happy with the front either tbh, now that you mention this sort of thing...

Neither am I, tbh, I just didn't want to bring it up.

 

[Jimbo87]

The work rate to be up there and the read to make the interception does not equal "handed to him on a plate".

The work rate to be where, he is in the line with a large chunk of the England team, granted he did well to read it but come on it had so much air on it

 

[Jimbo87]

What do you think are the things that need tweaking? Not saying that I disagree with you on JJ, I'm just curious about what you think needs changing.

No 10 has to be the biggest concern.

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

No 10 has to be the biggest concern.

I'd say 12 on the basis we haven't a clue who to play there. Faz is an out of position 10, Manu is an injured out of position 13, who knows what Slade is but he's out of touch and Teo is, I don't know as I haven't really seen him.

After 12, I'd say 9 as both Youngs and Care still have obvious flaws after 50+ caps.

 

[Peat]

In fact pretty much everything bar lock.

Wings are maybe just about okay.

I dunno man. There's a lot of air about what we need to change and everything, and, well, we can argue about what needs to change... or we can wait for the three games starting real soon that will give us a pretty darn concrete idea.

Or at least some fresh arguments because boy oh boy this is all rather stale.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Flankers are a mess.
Binny's a boss but you can't play both Haskell and Robshaw (or Wood) in the same backrow.


Hopefully Harrison is given a proper shot this tour.

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

Yeah but we've strung it out for 48 pages!

I think some are looking longer term. For this series I think the starting pack will be the GS one less Marler, with the real interest being at 10 and 12.

 

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

I'd say 12 on the basis we haven't a clue who to play there. Faz is an out of position 10, Manu is an injured out of position 13, who knows what Slade is but he's out of touch and Teo is, I don't know as I haven't really seen him.

After 12, I'd say 9 as both Youngs and Care still have obvious flaws after 50+ caps.

I honestly think that for now Burrell is our safest option at 12. Mixes physicality with distribution, is clearly hungry to do well and has formed a partnership with JJ in the past

 

[Bada-Bing!]

We'll know so much more after this test series.

Actually can't wait for the first game. This Saturday will be properly rugby heaven: NZ v Wales at 8.35am as a starter, followed by the main course at 11am and then for dessert SA v Ireland at 4pm.

Then anyone watching the Euros - Wales v Slovakia at 5pm; England v Russia at 8pm. Full day of sport. Anyone watching this all down the pub will be properly Trollied come 10pm.

And that's not to mention the under 20s matches going on.

 

[Every Time Ref]

Agree with Prat, this is getting us nowhere.

Tell you what, let's just agree to agree that JJ is the best option.

 

[Peat]

Agree with Prat, this is getting us nowhere.

Tell you what, let's just agree to agree that JJ is the best option.

Oh is that how it is :lol:

Trying to work out how many of the team will be making their 3rd or less SH test start. I think we're talking over half the team.

 

[Every Time Ref]

It was autocorrect, cross my heart!

 

[j'nuh]

In fact pretty much everything bar lock.

Hmm, IMO areas of strength:

Lock - great

Number 8 - Vunipola, Clifford, Beaumont, Hughes and Morgan? We're better here than lock.

13 - With Joseph, Tuilagi, Slade and Daly who can play there, we're pretty well off. Although perhaps Slade and Daly could get a bit more game time to settle nerves about Joseph getting injured. And I'm not totally convinced by Daly. And Slade might be better at 10...

Back three - Watson and Nowell are fairly clearly in a good position for being picked, and even if Nowell isn't fast enough for the wing, he can move to fullback. 2/3 starters already sorted. Then it's just a matter of finding a couple more players out of May, Sharples, Yarde, Wade, Rokoduguni, Lewington, Haley, and it's not like Brown has gone away just yet. We have the depth, we have the quality, we just need to get the tactics and selection right.

Blindside - Contentious one, but if the selection was between Underhill and Ewers, we're pretty damn set here too.

 

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

Hmm, IMO areas of strength:

Lock - great

Number 8 - Vunipola, Clifford, Beaumont, Hughes and Morgan? We're better here than lock.

13 - With Joseph, Tuilagi, Slade and Daly who can play there, we're pretty well off. Although perhaps Slade and Daly could get a bit more game time to settle nerves about Joseph getting injured. And I'm not totally convinced by Daly. And Slade might be better at 10...

Back three - Watson and Nowell are fairly clearly in a good position for being picked, and even if Nowell isn't fast enough for the wing, he can move to fullback. 2/3 starters already sorted. Then it's just a matter of finding a couple more players out of May, Sharples, Yarde, Wade, Rokoduguni, Lewington, Haley, and it's not like Brown has gone away just yet. We have the depth, we have the quality, we just need to get the tactics and selection right.

Blindside - Contentious one, but if the selection was between Underhill and Ewers, we're pretty damn set here too.

I'd say hooker and THP we're pretty well set too (Hooker: Hartley, George, Cowan-Dickie, Taylor, When fit Youngs. THP: Cole, Hill, Sinckler, Brookes, Thomas, Wilson?)

 

[Peat]

Ehhh... I'm nitpicking and advocating the counsel of perfection a little but...

HK - Hartley is a frustratingly incomplete player; Youngs lacks a consistently strong set piece game; everyone else lacks experience and proof of ability
THP - Cole is a frustratingly incomplete player; Dave Wilson is dead; everyone else lacks experience and proof of ability (and given how much refs do scrums on reputation, that's a bigger problem than most)
8 - Vunipola is unproven on hard SH pitches with fast moving games; Morgan is a bit incomplete and is struggling to find consistency due to injuries; same complaint about everyone else
13 - Joseph looks like he'll be a worthwhile player here for the rest of his career but needs more space to be a big asset; Tuilagi is horribly injury prone; same complaint about everyone else
6 - Seriously, we're saying we're okay because of two guys who've yet to play an international? Clucking bell j'nuh, that's a bit optimistic.
Back Three - Brown and Goode at full-back = Not happy. Questions over Nowell's pace, May's consistency, Yarde's defence, Wade's size etc.etc.

Seriously, right now, we've got one strong area - at least by the highest standards - and that's lock. Everything else is potential and nervousness and the knowledge that an injury or two could leave us sweating spinal fluid.

In fact, the second strongest area is, wait for it, probably...

Fly-half.

People really aren't going to like my guess at the third strongest position...

It was autocorrect, cross my heart!

 

[TRF_Olyy]

A lot of the Hooker talent (ho ho ho) is on potential, though.

THP I don't think looks particularly strong. I wouldn't trust many of those in an international game.