Brendan Venter - P**s taking W***er

[Bullitt]

Saracens Director of Rugby Brendan Venter said: "Saracens and England supporters can relax. It's not a serious problem and it certainly won't stop Steve from being available for the Investec Challenge Internationals but we will have to wait and see if he is available for Sunday's game against Gloucester."

http://www.guinnesspremiership.com/11802.php

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Bugger that, we don't want him playing for England

 

[mohamed_ali12]

I think this is very good news. Watched all three of the Saracens games and (in my opinion) has been the best lock in the league so far. Double-Header he dominated the line-out, made Kennedy look like a novice and did the same against Quins. Improved work at the breakdown to. In my opinion he is the best option we have to partner Shaw. Just listen what Venter said about him topping all the charts at Sarries. That is the kind of guy i want in my England team and as captain. If he can keep playing like this, I hope he stays as captain for a long time to come.

 

[MunsterMan]

Good news :lol:

He is undoubtedly a good GP lock, but I think it's his international credentials Mite is worried about.

 

[mohamed_ali12]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (MunsterMan @ Sep 21 2009, 06:39 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

Good news :lol:

He is undoubtedly a good GP lock, but I think it's his international credentials Mite is worried about.[/b]

Okay... but as i said he seems to have improved at the breakdown, and he dominated the line-out against Kennedy, who is our only other serious option. Added to that, when you're trying to instill some consistency into the team losing your captain is hardly a good thing.

 

[bristol-iain]

Despite being an annoying moron of a player, one who I met at a rugby summer school ran by Martin Redman but that's not the point, Borthwick is one of the form locks and it looks like leaving The Wreck for Sarries has paid off for him. England need him, which should please their opponents as there is going to be at least 1 sin-binning if he plays :lol:

 

[Bullitt]

Really? Simon Shaw, Courtney Lawes, Richard Blaze, Louis Deacon and Tom Croft will have a different opinion.

Borthwick is a relic that spent his career being carried by Danny Grewcock. He was only given the captaincy because of his Bath connections, and frankly with his temperament and discipline is a liability. He's also never been a player of international quality.

 

[mohamed_ali12]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Teh Mite @ Sep 21 2009, 06:52 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

Really? Simon Shaw, Courtney Lawes, Richard Blaze, Louis Deacon and Tom Croft will have a different opinion.

Borthwick is a relic that spent his career being carried by Danny Grewcock. He was only given the captaincy because of his Bath connections, and frankly with his temperament and discipline is a liability. He's also never been a player of international quality.[/b]

Hem hem...

Simon Shaw: As i said earlier he should be his lock partner
Courtney Lawes: To rush him into the England fold after not having played one match of even Saxons rugby would be stupid, plus even Jim Mallinder is taking it slow with him
Richard Blaze: Again, putting someone this inexperienced against Australia, New Zealand would be stupid - look what happened last year
Louis Deacon: Don't even joke
Tom Croft: An option but don't see him moving from 6, would like to see him in the second row but a bit light-weight?

 

[Prestwick]

He did have a superb game on Saturday against Quins and how he marshalled the drive to the Quins line that almost ended in a try was sublime.

As for Venter, ALL GP COACHES ARE P**S TAKING W***ERS! Its just that we, like women with loose morals defend our coaches by screaming loudly "DAWNCHA TALK 'BOUT MY VENTER/MALLINDER/BOOTH LIKE THAT YOU SLAG!

They're all as bad as each other and thats what makes the game so interesting

 

[Bullitt]

Moving Croft to the second row opens up the space in the back row for Rees or maybe even Ward-Smith.

And this years end of season tour to Australia will be the perfect time for Lawes and Blaze to step up.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Prestwick @ Sep 21 2009, 07:01 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

As for Venter, ALL GP COACHES ARE P**S TAKING W***ERS! Its just that we, like women with loose morals defend our coaches by screaming loudly "DAWNCHA TALK 'BOUT MY VENTER/MALLINDER/BOOTH LIKE THAT YOU SLAG!

They're all as bad as each other and thats what makes the game so interesting [/b]

No, really.... No.


Mallinder may be a diplomatic c*nt
Booth may be an arrognt c*nt
Richards may be a cheating c*nt
Hill may be an old c*nt
Ryan may be a stupid c*nt
Ashton may be a hard done by c*nt

But for all that...

Venter IS JUST a c*nt. Nothing more, nothing less.

 

[mohamed_ali12]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Teh Mite @ Sep 21 2009, 07:02 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

Moving Croft to the second row opens up the space in the back row for Rees or maybe even Ward-Smith.

And this years end of season tour to Australia will be the perfect time for Lawes and Blaze to step up.[/b]

And who would you make captain?

I say Borthwick deserves at least another season to prove himself, although one of Attwood/Lawes or Blaze should be moved into the team ahead of the crap that is Louis Deacon. Croft to second row is an interesting, would allow Robshaw to step in at six, for a back row of Robshaw - Easter - Rees, but Ward-Smith? Please he's 31, not the time to kick-start an international career in the back-row.

 

[gingergenius]

In general, there are 2 types of lock.

There are bullying, strong enforcers like Bakkies Botha, Martin Johnson, Simon Shaw etc.

There are locks who specialise in the lineout like Kennedy, Kay, Borthwick, Matfield, etc.

Last year, of the English locks, Simon Shaw was the only 'enforcer' type good enough, and he was out of form for the most part of the season.

Kennedy was the in-form lock, but he's a lightweight lineout specialist. Because Borthwick looks a bit bulkier than Kennedy, and was captain, suddenly he was expected to do the job both Bakkies Botha AND Victor Matfield. Which, because he is a good but not superhuman player, he was incapable of doing.

Borthwick hasn't been the best England captain, but then there's no one else in the team worthy for the job - all of the experienced players aren't ones with charisma like Dallaglio and Johnson.

He's getting blamed for the paucity of options England have at lock. We have Kay and Grewcock and Shaw with the experience. Kay is unreliable, Grewcock indisciplined and Shaw excellent but very old, out of form (last year), and also concedes 000s of penalties. We have Deacon and Palmer as established premiership players, but neither has ever stepped up to the plate at international level. And we have Lawes coming through, who I'm very excited about but still, he's coming through.

At the moment, he's a better lineout lock than Kennedy.

My England 2nd row for the AIs would be 4. Shaw, 5. Borthwick

 

[Prestwick]

I've heard that Blaze is injured which is a total let down but that Lawes has been turning heads for all the right reasons. How much game time does Lawes get?

I find it infuriating that pundits are trying to get Lamb & Geraghty to move to center in any eventual England XV. Because we haven't learnt from Matt Tait, have we?!

 

[Bullitt]

With only 2 year left to develop a WC squad, that really isn't an issue (see RFU, you've done it again!)

Captain wise;
(Starting at the front row)
- Dylan Hartley has demonstrated an ability as captain with Northampton already. Maybe it's early days, but there's a future option.
- If he ever gets his call up, people have regularly called Richard Blaze the next Martin Johnson. The Leicester link won't hurt his chances either.
- Mark Easter
- Chris Robshaw
- Tom Croft
- Jordan Crane
- Jonny Wilkinson already has been England captain.

 

[gingergenius]

And is there anyone you would rather see fail than Saracens Mite?

 

[Prestwick]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Teh Mite @ Sep 21 2009, 06:02 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

Moving Croft to the second row opens up the space in the back row for Rees or maybe even Ward-Smith.

And this years end of season tour to Australia will be the perfect time for Lawes and Blaze to step up.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Prestwick @ Sep 21 2009, 07:01 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

As for Venter, ALL GP COACHES ARE P**S TAKING W***ERS! Its just that we, like women with loose morals defend our coaches by screaming loudly "DAWNCHA TALK 'BOUT MY VENTER/MALLINDER/BOOTH LIKE THAT YOU SLAG!

They're all as bad as each other and thats what makes the game so interesting [/b]

No, really.... No.


Mallinder may be a diplomatic c*nt
Booth may be an arrognt c*nt
Richards may be a cheating c*nt
Hill may be an old c*nt
Ryan may be a stupid c*nt
Ashton may be a hard done by c*nt

But for all that...

Venter IS JUST a c*nt. Nothing more, nothing less.
[/b][/quote]

DON'T YOU TALK ABOUT MY VENTER LIKE THAT YOU SLAG!!!!

 

[Bullitt]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (gingergenius @ Sep 21 2009, 07:10 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

And is there anyone you would rather see fail than Saracens Mite?[/b]

Yep. But Australia failing isn't a new phenomenon.

 

[mohamed_ali12]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (gingergenius @ Sep 21 2009, 07:08 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

In general, there are 2 types of lock.

There are bullying, strong enforcers like Bakkies Botha, Martin Johnson, Simon Shaw etc.

There are locks who specialise in the lineout like Kennedy, Kay, Borthwick, Matfield, etc.

Last year, of the English locks, Simon Shaw was the only 'enforcer' type good enough, and he was out of form for the most part of the season.

Kennedy was the in-form lock, but he's a lightweight lineout specialist. Because Borthwick looks a bit bulkier than Kennedy, and was captain, suddenly he was expected to do the job both Bakkies Botha AND Victor Matfield. Which, because he is a good but not superhuman player, he was incapable of doing.

Borthwick hasn't been the best England captain, but then there's no one else in the team worthy for the job - all of the experienced players aren't ones with charisma like Dallaglio and Johnson.

He's getting blamed for the paucity of options England have at lock. We have Kay and Grewcock and Shaw with the experience. Kay is unreliable, Grewcock indisciplined and Shaw excellent but very old, out of form (last year), and also concedes 000s of penalties. We have Deacon and Palmer as established premiership players, but neither has ever stepped up to the plate at international level. And we have Lawes coming through, who I'm very excited about but still, he's coming through.

At the moment, he's a better lineout lock than Kennedy.

My England 2nd row for the AIs would be 4. Shaw, 5. Borthwick[/b]

Agree with almost everything you say, but Grewcock is no longer indisciplined. He is a new man, i assure you. Your talking about the EDF community player of the year - that means he's a nice guy.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Teh Mite @ Sep 21 2009, 07:09 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

With only 2 year left to develop a WC squad, that really isn't an issue (see RFU, you've done it again!)

Captain wise;
(Starting at the front row)
- Dylan Hartley has demonstrated an ability as captain with Northampton already. Maybe it's early days, but there's a future option.
- If he ever gets his call up, people have regularly called Richard Blaze the next Martin Johnson. The Leicester link won't hurt his chances either.
- Mark Easter
- Chris Robshaw
- Tom Croft
- Jordan Crane
- Jonny Wilkinson already has been England captain.[/b]

Mark Easter? Chris Robshaw? Jordan Crane? None of which are captains at club level or established international players, plus if you're talking about booting Borthwick out next June, these are hardly going to be good solutions.

Wilkinson, if he stays fit yes a good option
Hartley, needs to assure himself of a starting place first (which i hope he does)
Croft i think could be the man for the job post 2011.

 

[bristol-iain]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (gingergenius @ Sep 21 2009, 07:10 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

And is there anyone you would rather see fail than Saracens Mite?[/b]

I havent seen a dislike of a team like this for a while. I mean I don't like Bath (sorry ali ) but I don't take it as far as Mr Mite.

 

[Bullitt]

Bah, Grewcock has had a chip on his shoulder since 2003 when Mark Connors beat the living crap out of him. He's been taking it out on everyone else ever since, fist first.

 

[mohamed_ali12]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (bristol-iain @ Sep 21 2009, 07:14 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (gingergenius @ Sep 21 2009, 07:10 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

And is there anyone you would rather see fail than Saracens Mite?[/b]

I havent seen a dislike of a team like this for a while. I mean I don't like Bath (sorry ali ) but I don't take it as far as Mr Mite.
[/b][/quote]

what did we do?