Ireland to host 2023 Rugby world cup ?

[Amiga500]

Think the Italians should get a look in before SA and France get another chance to host! They have the stadiums, interest is rising quite rapidly, so if they get the Serie A club's on board, they could host a damn good tournament I reckon

+1

And it would be easy to persuade the managing director (aka the missus) to make that little jaunt tie in with holidays!!! :lol:

 

[munstermuffin]

The GAA are already upgrading several of the stadia mentioned.




One stand out of 4 has been done.



Same goes for the stadium that has yet to be rebuilt?



Uh-huh.

If there are serious injuries they are taken to hospital.

If its a blood injury requiring a few stitches wise up.



You make assumptions as to my background and knowledge of the football scene. Bad, bad, bad assumptions.

So, by your reckoning the stadia in nearly every county are used for the club provincial championship when its down to the last 8 teams in each province? Which will be 4 games, then 2, then 1. So after the QFs (which are staggered), there are only 2 grounds in each province being used (if the SFs aren't a double header).

Off the top of my head, places like Mullingar, Newry, Armagh, Tullamore, Portlaoise, Newbridge etc are not going to be considered for RWC venues but are more than sufficient for provincial club games.

After the first round of provincial clubs (which is home and away), it moves to neutral venues - which wouldn't even have to be the designated county ground of the county its played in.



I've never been to Pearce so cannot comment definitively, but in any sizable ground I've played or watched in, you cannot simply walk between seated and standing areas without climbing over a fence.



Obviously this is not the place for a detailed examination of economics... but for example - if the hotel industry is expecting several hundred thousand people to descend on Ireland for the RWC, do you not think they are going to make sure their hotels are in top nick? Who do you think is gonna do the work on it?

Well on top Semple Stadium done 1 stand and as far as I know the refurbishments there are finished and again that has medical rooms.

Pairc Ui Chaoimh is a â'¬60m+ project but has yet to get the green light due to issues with Planning but from research it seems it's planned with RWC in mind.

Regards medical facilities - All stadiums MUST have 2 medical/first aid rooms for spectators which must fit certain criteria set out regards size, fittings and facilities and meet requirements of local ambulance. These rooms must be separate from the players designated medical facilities which must also meet criteria.

Regards you thinking I'm slamming your knowledge of GAA as I presume you are a GAA fan like me. I'm not but only speaking from my experience in Munster. You are an Ulster football man I guess but that is a lot different to say Munster etc. And I am basing it on not the provincial but here in Munster and places like Clare the club championships stall until end of inter county season and county championships really only get going in late September and it's a rush so that was my point regards backlog of games. And in Munster it's usually home advantage but played in County Grounds ie Limerick Champs would play at Gaelic Grounds not their home pitch. Like it's just views from you as an Ulster football man and me more Hurling than Football but have played inter county football.

And a few stadiums around here it's very easy to get around but I'd ask regards GAA stadiums that have the barb wire fences behind goals (eg Pairc Ui Chaoimh) would they all have to be removed and walls built.

I agree with your point regards hotels etc but Amiga this is a valid point, while I agree and presume your from North and Britain here in Republic taxes and all that make hotels think different. They will know they don't have to do upgrades and will still sell. My example is Garth Brooks concerts. A lot of hotels the previous Friday or Saturday will cost â'¬119 per night. On nights of Garth Brooks the same rooms cost â'¬444 per night and they're sold out

 

[SimonG]

One thing that does embarrass me (and I say this as a proud Irishman) is the third world facilities we have. Even NZ (similar size country/resources) outclass us in that department. Croke Park is ok I suppose (its far from state of the art), the Aviva is...well, think championship level English ground (Derby County). Us paupers in the north..Windsor Park (less said the better), Ravenhill (think 2nd division English ground). And that's yer lot.

We are a million miles (years) away from hosting a Rugby WC. We tried to co-host (with Scotland) one of the Euro tournaments (think it was Euro 2012) and that got no-where. Scotland have Celtic Park, Ibrox, Hampden, Murrayfield...puts what we have to shame. The Gaelic stadiums are not conference standard. They would fail most health and safety regulations.

 

[McTallshort]

Given the IRB profit demands there are only 3 nations who can really host a WC. England, France and possibly SA.

 

[Nielsch]

Please, no Ireland / Scotland / Wales... World Cups in the British Isles seem so generic. When the World Cup comes back to Europe in 2023 or 2027 they should give it to Italy (if they can make a deal the with football union regarding the use of football stadiums during the RWC). Any non-European RWC after 2019 should go to South Africa first and maybe the USA or Argentina after that. However it'll depend on the development of rugby in the USA and I'm just not too sure about the Argentinian infrastructure though.

 

[siochain]

One thing that does embarrass me (and I say this as a proud Irishman) is the third world facilities we have. Even NZ (similar size country/resources) outclass us in that department. Croke Park is ok I suppose (its far from state of the art), the Aviva is...well, think championship level English ground (Derby County). Us paupers in the north..Windsor Park (less said the better), Ravenhill (think 2nd division English ground). And that's yer lot.

We are a million miles (years) away from hosting a Rugby WC. We tried to co-host (with Scotland) one of the Euro tournaments (think it was Euro 2012) and that got no-where. Scotland have Celtic Park, Ibrox, Hampden, Murrayfield...puts what we have to shame. The Gaelic stadiums are not conference standard. They would fail most health and safety regulations.

If we had one main field sport like NZ I'm sure we would have as good if not better facilities . We have different sporting organisations GAA, IRFU and FAI all doing their own thing. I really like the French set up with municipal stadiums.

 

[SimonG]

If we had one main field sport like NZ I'm sure we would have as good if not better facilities . We have different sporting organisations GAA, IRFU and FAI all doing their own thing. I really like the French set up with municipal stadiums.

Good point, never really thought about that. All NZ have is Rugby so they throw all their eggs in one basket.

 

[munstermuffin]

If we had one main field sport like NZ I'm sure we would have as good if not better facilities . We have different sporting organisations GAA, IRFU and FAI all doing their own thing. I really like the French set up with municipal stadiums.

While this is accurate if agree with SimonG in that stadiums are sub standard and that was my argument to Amiga. This post is the reason behind it. They're all doing their own thing and while in my opinion every GAA stadium hosting games would need work who'd pay. Will IRFU pump millions in to stadiums that possibly no Irish team (province or national team at any grade) will play in ever for the sake of a few weeks. The GAA couldn't care less if Ireland host it and won't invest a cent. They're debt free and after this summer I'd imagine money will never be a problem in that organization. Facts are IRFU don't have facilities on their own and maybe the economy in Ireland might get boost for few weeks it's on but IRFU will struggle to break even never mind profit from World Cup. I remember in New Zealand there was issue over ticket sales. The IRB have to make so much and well after all bills are paid (Let's remember GAA want at least â'¬500k per game in any stadium if used) then budget will be slim

 

[nickdnz]

SimonG knows so much about New Zealand...

We don't play cricket or football here obviously...

 

[SimonG]

SimonG knows so much about New Zealand...

We don't play cricket or football here obviously...

Correct me, doesn't the cricket team play at the same field as the rugby team? I don't watch cricket but I recall flicking through sky channels and seeing NZ play in what looked like a rugby stadium (the seats were grey I think).

Just had a quick google and it does appear that other sports do play in Rugby stadiums in NZ. This is something we should be emulating..problem as was mentioned above we have so many governing bodies of different sports who each serve their own interests. Croke park banning "British" sports was just one example of how political it gets. In the north we can't get a stadium built due to various shenanigans.

 

[William18]

SimonG knows so much about New Zealand...

We don't play cricket or football here obviously...

SimonG knows so much about New Zealand...

We don't play cricket or football here obviously...

With respect, I think this shows you don't know much about Ireland.

In New Zealand, we don't have any football stadiums of any major size. When football is played here it is played in established rugby grounds or else in very small community stadiums. Cricket is sometimes played in multi-purpose venues like Eden Park, MacLean Park or Westpac Stadium. For test matches we generally use purpose built stadiums and this has been the trend in recent years.

Ireland is completely different. They have had a history of social problems and politics in rife in their sports in comparison to New Zealand. Ireland has many football stadiums, rugby stadiums and GAA grounds. Their only multi purpose stadiums seem to be the Aviva and Thormond Park. In Ireland most of the stadiums are not owned by the local authorities but either by the IRFU, the GAA or the individual football team. This doesn't cause problems in places like Old Trafford. Man U are a big club and can spend money on their stadium and ensure it stays up to standard. Most sports in Ireland do not have a lot of money so cannot reinvest in their stadiums. In New Zealand our stadiums are either owned by trusts (Eden Park, Westpac) or by the city council (Waikato Stadium, Forsyth Barr).

The ridiculous thing is there is no reason not to have ground shares in Ireland. In Wellington most of us are unhappy as we have a multipurpose stadium used for cricket and rugby. Since it is an oval stadium, you are too far away from the action for rugby. It makes sense for cricket and rugby to play in different stadiums. In Ireland hurling, gaelic football, football and rugby can all be played on the same field! There is no reason not to have ground shares.

Something like this would make sense to me for a RWC:

Irish Stadiums:

- National Stadium 85,000 (GAA finals, rugby internationals, some football internationals. Owned by the Irish government)
- Dublin City Stadium 35,000 (Leinster rugby, Dublin GAA, some football internationals. Owned by the Dublin City Council).
- Limerick 45,000 (A modern all-seater in Limerick).
- Cork 35,000
- Northern Ireland National Stadium 35,000
- Galway 25,000
- Derry Stadium 22,000

If you had those seven stadiums then you would probably still need to add about 3 more GAA stadiums for a RWC. Ireland's stadiums could easily look like that. All the stadiums could be top class facilities and would be well used as they would all be multipurpose. You just have to look at the political problems when Northern Ireland tried to build a multipurpose stadium which shows that any new stadium is unlikely to go ahead. It's a shame because Ireland could host a World Cup if you at passion for the game and population. However, with the stadiums that Irish fans have been putting out you guys don't have a chance.

 

[munstermuffin]

With respect, I think this shows you don't know much about Ireland.

In New Zealand, we don't have any football stadiums of any major size. When football is played here it is played in established rugby grounds or else in very small community stadiums. Cricket is sometimes played in multi-purpose venues like Eden Park, MacLean Park or Westpac Stadium. For test matches we generally use purpose built stadiums and this has been the trend in recent years.

Ireland is completely different. They have had a history of social problems and politics in rife in their sports in comparison to New Zealand. Ireland has many football stadiums, rugby stadiums and GAA grounds. Their only multi purpose stadiums seem to be the Aviva and Thormond Park. In Ireland most of the stadiums are not owned by the local authorities but either by the IRFU, the GAA or the individual football team. This doesn't cause problems in places like Old Trafford. Man U are a big club and can spend money on their stadium and ensure it stays up to standard. Most sports in Ireland do not have a lot of money so cannot reinvest in their stadiums. In New Zealand our stadiums are either owned by trusts (Eden Park, Westpac) or by the city council (Waikato Stadium, Forsyth Barr).

The ridiculous thing is there is no reason not to have ground shares in Ireland. In Wellington most of us are unhappy as we have a multipurpose stadium used for cricket and rugby. Since it is an oval stadium, you are too far away from the action for rugby. It makes sense for cricket and rugby to play in different stadiums. In Ireland hurling, gaelic football, football and rugby can all be played on the same field! There is no reason not to have ground shares.

Something like this would make sense to me for a RWC:

Irish Stadiums:

- National Stadium 85,000 (GAA finals, rugby internationals, some football internationals. Owned by the Irish government)
- Dublin City Stadium 35,000 (Leinster rugby, Dublin GAA, some football internationals. Owned by the Dublin City Council).
- Limerick 45,000 (A modern all-seater in Limerick).
- Cork 35,000
- Northern Ireland National Stadium 35,000
- Galway 25,000
- Derry Stadium 22,000

If you had those seven stadiums then you would probably still need to add about 3 more GAA stadiums for a RWC. Ireland's stadiums could easily look like that. All the stadiums could be top class facilities and would be well used as they would all be multipurpose. You just have to look at the political problems when Northern Ireland tried to build a multipurpose stadium which shows that any new stadium is unlikely to go ahead. It's a shame because Ireland could host a World Cup if you at passion for the game and population. However, with the stadiums that Irish fans have been putting out you guys don't have a chance.

Thing is everyone has their own stadium for requirements. GAA will never abandon Croke Park for New Stadium they don't own.
Dublin GAA have Croker and Parnell Park while we don't play enough home internationals in rugby or football to split venues.
Limerick GAA have invested too much in to Gaelic Grounds and well Munster will never leave Thomond Park.

Like William I understand your views but politics in sporting bodies here is 100+ years old and them issues will never ever be agreed and that's before the squibble of funding. All you have to understand is the history of GAA to see it'll be a no-go

 

[nickdnz]

With respect, I think this shows you don't know much about Ireland.

In New Zealand, we don't have any football stadiums of any major size. When football is played here it is played in established rugby grounds or else in very small community stadiums. Cricket is sometimes played in multi-purpose venues like Eden Park, MacLean Park or Westpac Stadium. For test matches we generally use purpose built stadiums and this has been the trend in recent years.

Ireland is completely different. They have had a history of social problems and politics in rife in their sports in comparison to New Zealand. Ireland has many football stadiums, rugby stadiums and GAA grounds. Their only multi purpose stadiums seem to be the Aviva and Thormond Park. In Ireland most of the stadiums are not owned by the local authorities but either by the IRFU, the GAA or the individual football team. This doesn't cause problems in places like Old Trafford. Man U are a big club and can spend money on their stadium and ensure it stays up to standard. Most sports in Ireland do not have a lot of money so cannot reinvest in their stadiums. In New Zealand our stadiums are either owned by trusts (Eden Park, Westpac) or by the city council (Waikato Stadium, Forsyth Barr).

The ridiculous thing is there is no reason not to have ground shares in Ireland. In Wellington most of us are unhappy as we have a multipurpose stadium used for cricket and rugby. Since it is an oval stadium, you are too far away from the action for rugby. It makes sense for cricket and rugby to play in different stadiums. In Ireland hurling, gaelic football, football and rugby can all be played on the same field! There is no reason not to have ground shares.

Something like this would make sense to me for a RWC:

Irish Stadiums:

- National Stadium 85,000 (GAA finals, rugby internationals, some football internationals. Owned by the Irish government)
- Dublin City Stadium 35,000 (Leinster rugby, Dublin GAA, some football internationals. Owned by the Dublin City Council).
- Limerick 45,000 (A modern all-seater in Limerick).
- Cork 35,000
- Northern Ireland National Stadium 35,000
- Galway 25,000
- Derry Stadium 22,000

If you had those seven stadiums then you would probably still need to add about 3 more GAA stadiums for a RWC. Ireland's stadiums could easily look like that. All the stadiums could be top class facilities and would be well used as they would all be multipurpose. You just have to look at the political problems when Northern Ireland tried to build a multipurpose stadium which shows that any new stadium is unlikely to go ahead. It's a shame because Ireland could host a World Cup if you at passion for the game and population. However, with the stadiums that Irish fans have been putting out you guys don't have a chance.

Right, so our three largest stadiums are not purpose built stadiums? Eden Park, Westpac and formally AMI (prior to earthquake) all are multi-purpose. I'll be going to Westpac Stadium tomorrow to watch the football. The rest of your post I am largely aware of. My contention was with New Zealand not playing other sports and therefore not requiring any other stadiums - meerly that many of the big stadiums are built to provide for multiple sports - obviously in contention with "Good point, never really thought about that. All NZ have is Rugby so they throw all their eggs in one basket". I don't know where you assume my lack of knowledge about Ireland or which part of my post you disagree with.

 

[Feicarsinn]

Regards stadium sharing, it's a difficult one to work. Take a look at this photo of Croke Park for one of the internationals played there a few years back. The fans are massively far back from the pitch. Now Croke Park is a big pitch even within the GAA, but even smaller ones dwarf rugby and soccer dimensions. GAA stadiums do not lend themselves well to good rugby or soccer atmospheres unfortunately. I went to a few Ireland games at Croker. Not a wonderful experience.

 

[Amiga500]

Regards stadium sharing, it's a difficult one to work. Take a look at this photo of Croke Park for one of the internationals played there a few years back. The fans are massively far back from the pitch. Now Croke Park is a big pitch even within the GAA, but even smaller ones dwarf rugby and soccer dimensions. GAA stadiums do not lend themselves well to good rugby or soccer atmospheres unfortunately. I went to a few Ireland games at Croker. Not a wonderful experience.

Yep, the pitch sizes are completely non compatible and that is the biggest issue with any RWC bid.

Anything else is a relatively straightforward fix.

 

[Amiga500]

that stadiums are sub standard and that was my argument to Amiga.

They aren't.

They are safe, they are large and they are more than fit for the job. They are sub-standard in your head because you believe them to be.

Question 1 - when is the last time someone was seriously injured at a GAA ground as a result of a deficiency of the ground itself?

Question 2 - when is the last time someone suffered death or grevious injury as a result of an inability to have immediate treatment of the required standard at a GAA ground?


The biggest obstacle, as mentioned in posts above, is the pitch size.

 

[Rumpi]

Yep, the pitch sizes are completely non compatible and that is the biggest issue with any RWC bid.

Anything else is a relatively straightforward fix.

Totally agree, would work for World Cup maybe, but not ideal for building municipal ground shares.

 

[Amiga500]

Yeah, to get around it you'd need a sliding lower tier or something similar... which then has knock-on affects on pitch quality and stadia cost.


Its a no-goer from the start.

 

[Rumpi]

They aren't.

They are safe, they are large and they are more than fit for the job. They are sub-standard in your head because you believe them to be.

Question 1 - when is the last time someone was seriously injured at a GAA ground as a result of a deficiency of the ground itself?

Question 2 - when is the last time someone suffered death or grevious injury as a result of an inability to have immediate treatment of the required standard at a GAA ground?


The biggest obstacle, as mentioned in posts above, is the pitch size.

Agree again, while some of the older GAA grounds are a bit tired, very few of them are in a really bad way, Páirc Uí Chaoimh is the worst i can think of but it is due to be replaced with a modern all seater.

There are quite a few good recent renovations, o'moore park in portlaoise, O'Conner park in tullamore.

All of them have recently had safety audits & capacities adjusted where required.

Sure none of them are on a par with Croke park, but they don't need to be, a small investment in medical facilities would bring them up to speed if required.

Heard some of the stadia in nz were basic enough, but small regional stadia don't need plush carpets & premium levels, they just need to provide a safe environment to play & watch matches.

 

[Feicarsinn]

They aren't.

They are safe, they are large and they are more than fit for the job. They are sub-standard in your head because you believe them to be.

Question 1 - when is the last time someone was seriously injured at a GAA ground as a result of a deficiency of the ground itself?

Question 2 - when is the last time someone suffered death or grevious injury as a result of an inability to have immediate treatment of the required standard at a GAA ground?


The biggest obstacle, as mentioned in posts above, is the pitch size.

I've played in a number of inter county grounds in my time within the GAA, an awful lot of them are near third world in standard. You see the stands on the TV, but that's only the surface. Mediocre transport links, poor facilities for supporters, inadequate press facilities, really poor quality changing rooms and team preparation facilities. The list goes on and on. And that's in some of the more reputable grounds in the country.

Regarding your questions, is the standard we hold a stadium to really based on how long it's been since some one was killed there? I mean really? Come on.