[Natwest 6 Nations] Round 3 : Scotland Vs England 24/02/2018 16:45

[Leonormous Boozer]

I've got no problem with penalising Launchbury its a blatant penalty but it has to be called as advantage or not be seen that you need to check with TMO neither of which happened. My issue stems from consistency of refereeing if you tell a player to stop and he does, then you agree, you've allowed him to do it, you can't retrospectively give a penalty for it. Otherwise it causes a problem for every official in every match why stop doing something if the ref tell you to if your just going to get peanlised for it anyway? Also there the fact Owens was letting Scotland get away with all sort of malarkey at the breakdown that was just as blatant as that.

Owens has two choices officiate the breakdown properly or allow the intercept try. He can't have it both ways otherwise he's just saying 'you can break the rules as long as you don't score a try of it'.



Jone Boy do you ever comment on a match before a game? Or do you always just come in like the messiah after the fact? I know if I could be arsed find loads of posts of you praising EJ and what a great a job he's done with England. but nah you'd rather be on the wind-up.

I think it depends on what you want the ref to do, a lot of people say stuff like"I don't mind the ref being wrong as long as he's consistent" I think that's a weak standard. I'd rather a ref get 3/10 calls right and be inconsistent than to get them all wrong. Owens got it right here while completely exposing his own substandard officiating, that's a win-win in my books because I want Owens off the circuit more than the likes of Poite and Lacey, the latter two are totally inconsistent but the former is consistently wrong in a lot of aspects of play, that's not good enough. (None of them are good enough but you get my point)

 

[ncurd]

Honestly I'd rather Launchbury be called up on it whilst he was doing it. I'd also like to see it happen all the other times as well.

I think I've said this before but England's lack of acknowledgement the breakdown exists relies heavilly on offcials policing it. And some of that probably stems by high profile domestic matches being reffed by Wayne Barnes who has a reputation of being 'over offcious' at the breakdown.



However that said these are the refs they have I'd rather they were right, but if they are going to be wrong at least be consistent about it.

 

[ThebigARena]

Eh, i tend to think the only reason Australia beat the darkness last year was because they had an off night.

Scotland are the real deal though.

But Scotland over the course of the year will lose matches , yes they are new and improved but they play such a high tempo attacking style of play it almost fine margins , take that miracle pass from Russell that easily could of been intercepted on another day . Scotland will need a similar display to beat Ireland and I just don't think they will be was accurate , Finn. Russell is a majestic player when it's all coming off for him the issue for Finn Russell is he doesn't have a plan b when it's going wrong, take the Wales game they came with a high tempo but the accuracy was off and they got punished , Russell still played his game even though it wasnt working for him that day. Sometimes you know it's not your day so you either change tactics or the management recognise and make changes , Scotland failed to do that against us. They showed they have a dogged win in them against France . But Ireland are a different ball game .

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

Honestly I'd rather Launchbury be called up on it whilst he was doing it. I'd also like to see it happen all the other times as well.

I think I've said this before but England's lack of acknowledgement the breakdown exists relies heavilly on offcials policing it. And some of that probably stems by high profile domestic matches being reffed by Wayne Barnes who has a reputation of being 'over offcious' at the breakdown.



However that said these are the refs they have I'd rather they were right, but if they are going to be wrong at least be consistent about it.

Yeah I suppose that's fair, I definitely think Barnes must ref the Prem and then European and International games differently, Owens is the same between club and International.

We disagree about consistency vs getting as many calls as possible right and I've definitely had that argument with some posters after Wales beat us in 2015. I think this incident is an example of when he was about to **** the Scots over and then saved himself to England's annoyance. There were times he really ****** England, the first of those two quick fire turnovers in Scotland's 22 was illegal in multiple ways for example and was definitely a better example of England getting ****** over.

 

[ThebigARena]

Eh, i tend to think the only reason Australia beat the darkness last year was because they had an off night.

Scotland are the real deal though.

But Scotland over the course of the year will lose matches , yes they are new and improved but they play such a high tempo attacking style of play it almost fine margins , take that miracle pass from Russell that easily could of been intercepted on another day . Scotland will need a similar display to beat Ireland and I just don't think they will be was accurate , Finn. Russell is a majestic player when it's all coming off for him the issue for Finn Russell is he doesn't have a plan b when it's going wrong, take the Wales game they came with a high tempo but the accuracy was off and they got punished , Russell still played his game even though it wasnt working for him that day. Sometimes you know it's not your day so you either change tactics or the management recognise and make changes , Scotland failed to do that against us. They showed they have a dogged win in them against France . But Ireland are a different ball game .

 

[ncurd]

Yeah I suppose that's fair, I definitely think Barnes must ref the Prem and then European and International games differently, Owens is the same between club and International.

We disagree about consistency vs getting as many calls as possible right and I've definitely had that argument with some posters after Wales beat us in 2015. I think this incident is an example of when he was about to **** the Scots over and then saved himself to England's annoyance. There were times he really ****** England, the first of those two quick fire turnovers in Scotland's 22 was illegal in multiple ways for example and was definitely a better example of England getting ****** over.

I think its a nexus point of frustrations with Owens in the match. I find the Care not being able to pass because of a Scottish player @ kickable distance/position. Owens proclaiming a player was on his feat when he clearly had his kneww on the ground. And turnovers such as you mentioned more highlighting of a refereee performance I'd sooner forget. But not being awarded a try because of something you let off and have been all match it leaves a bad taste in the mouth.



But lets not forget if we actually competed at the breakdown and were a little more clinical in some passes we'd have won despite this. A great team wins despite being on the wrong side of ref.

 

[Hastie7]

We probably will be.
Depressing part is that'll be enough for a comfortable win

so talk me through this again

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

If cockers didn't get fired by Leicester, he wouldn't have gone to Toulon, where he might not have ended up at edinburgh, where MaCinally, Berghan etc might not have found their edge and therefore Scotland would lose the game.

By that logic IMO Cockers won Scotland the Calcutta cup and therefore the english still won it.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

If cockers didn't get fired by Leicester, he wouldn't have gone to Toulon, where he might not have ended up at edinburgh, where MaCinally, Berghan etc might not have found their edge and therefore Scotland would lose the game.

By that logic IMO Cockers won Scotland the Calcutta cup and therefore the english still won it.

With the amount of English Scottish internationals we won the cup whichever way the scoreline went.

 

[General Melchett]

If cockers didn't get fired by Leicester, he wouldn't have gone to Toulon, where he might not have ended up at edinburgh, where MaCinally, Berghan etc might not have found their edge and therefore Scotland would lose the game.

By that logic IMO Cockers won Scotland the Calcutta cup and therefore the english still won it.

He's one of us now and has changed his name to Dick McCockers

 

[g6mcg]

"I had haggis for tea every day as a child"

 

[Hastie7]

To me Lawes doesn't offer enough at 6. He is a second row and was outstanding there for the Lions in NZ. If Robshaw comes up against a specialist 7 he struggles or especially two good sevens as we saw on Saturday. He slows the ball down but doesn't win enough turn overs or pens. JG also offers a lot more than Hartley. To my eyes this would be a more balanced England side.
15. Brown
14. Watson
13. Joseph
12. Farrell
11. Nowell
10. Ford
9. Care/Youngs
1. Vunipola
2. George
3. Cole
4. Launchbury
5. Lawes
6. Haskell
7. Underhill
8. Hughes

Or midfield of 10. Farrell 12. Te'o 13. Joseph

 

[White Cockade]

Scotland won the match and were the far better team on the day
Would be good if people could acknowledge that without all the whataboutery about the ref which is just sour grapes
By the same token England have lost only their second game in God knows how many and are one of the top three teams in the world
Eddie Jones has done a great job for them and one bad result doesn't change that
The fact is no team can go unbeaten forever and the form does start to go under the pressure of an ever increasing undefeated run
They will regroup and come out stronger
As for Scotland i'd love us to go and win in Dublin but just can't see it
If we did we'd probably lose to Italy anyway!
That's what it's like following Scotland

 

[Chief Pete]

Would be good if people could acknowledge that without all the whataboutery about the ref which is just sour grapes

I thought people were? Scotland were great on the day....

 

[TommiG88]

I thought people were? Scotland were great on the day....

Everyone has agreed Scotland were the better team and deserved the win.

 

[Bruce_ma gooshvili]

First half Scotland took a lot of chances with long floated passes, They came off. It could just as easily gone the other way, with the passes intercepted. However, Huw Jones looked an excellent prospect, surely some Welsh blood there with a name like that.

Apparently not. One side of his family comes from near the Welsh border, but in England. Baffling but apparently true. Must just be the natural allure of Welsh names that made his family pick Huw.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

Would be good if people could acknowledge that without all the whataboutery about the ref which is just sour grapes

There are more people complaining about English people complaining than there are English people actually complaining.

 

[TommiG88]

Wilson cited for making contact with the eye of Hughes.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

4-6 weeks is my guess,
Clearly accidental in a bit of handbags, but still made contact with/raked his eye

 

[Hastie7]

Wilson's discipline is terrible on and off the field. He's a good player and his work rate is impressive but Denton or Strauss are IMO better 8s. So wouldn't be the end of the world for me if he gets a ban although I didn't see much in the actual incident.