Toulon withdrawal

[tituslechmakus]

Bernard Laporte threatened to withdrawal for the next Toulon match in Castres because he only has 1 professional prop and hooker, due to injuries, suspensions and international november tests. He would be forced to use youth players, who never played at professional level. He said he fears so much major injuries for these guys that he prefers to withdrawal.

Do you think it is a bluff to force LNR and FFR to stop these ridiculous and contested "doublons" (top 14 matches during international matches) or is he serious and will really withdrawal in case of refuse from the french rugby authorities ?

And do you agree with him ?

For me, I totally agree with him. France is the only nation to favour his clubs championship rather than national team.

 

[TRF_stormer2010]

I'd agree with him if he truly fears for these players' safety which I can imagine could be a legitimate concern. Thatsaid it's a case of bad resource planning from RCT rather than an unavoidable and unfair scenario IMO as I'd imagine the club top brass could reasonably be expected to have forseen this scenario given the players on their roster.

 

[nickdnz]

Let him withdraw. He knew all the players other than Chiocci and Menini were internationals prior to joining Toulon (he's lucky South Africa don't want Burden). He could argue Toulon are punished for having French internationals, however they won two championships on the basis of having few French internationals while teams like Toulouse lost their players. Like always, Laporte is throwing his toys out the pram because he doesn't want to have to play by the rules. Injuries and suspensions are unfortunate but it's something every club has to deal with. So no, I don't agree with him unless he genuinely feels there is no option left but to withdraw due to risks to player welfare. If that's the case then he absolutely should, but that's his problem and not anyone elses

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Other teams put out academy front rowers if there's injuries.
Shouldn't bend the rules for this ****.

 

[Big Ewis]

Let him withdraw. He knew all the players other than Chiocci and Menini were internationals prior to joining Toulon (he's lucky South Africa don't want Burden). He could argue Toulon are punished for having French internationals, however they won two championships on the basis of having few French internationals while teams like Toulouse lost their players. Like always, Laporte is throwing his toys out the pram because he doesn't want to have to play by the rules. Injuries and suspensions are unfortunate but it's something every club has to deal with. So no, I don't agree with him unless he genuinely feels there is no option left but to withdraw due to risks to player welfare. If that's the case then he absolutely should, but that's his problem and not anyone elses

not relevant in the least measure here, he's part of the absences as he's injured..."like always", haha...right, he's been notorious for that hasn't he. Are you just now confusing Bernard Laporte and owner Mourad Boudjellal ??...And yes it's his and Toulon's problem and not anyone else's, that much is clear ... (??...).
Actually it's Castres' also, the team they should go to next weekend, as there's a show to insure and Toulon coming to town generates a lot of revenue and excitement.

There's no need to get into the old "they knew from the start what issues they'd run into", I mean SEVEN absences in your front row. Seven.
- Chilachava, their TH choice after Hayman (injured) was trained in the Toulon academies and now Georgia are picking him for int'ls. Castro gets suspended. That's TH.
- Now Guirado is a French int'l, no problem, but Burden who was an amazing find they weren't using at all in SA gets injured just last week, that's hookers.
- And Chiocci - Menini are now both picked at LH for France (academy trained and born in Toulon - revived in Toulon last year got selected since, respectively).

He's got a French Tighthead from Pro D2 and a young but regular homegrown Toulonais hooker now, THAT'S IT, for the match. The concern is real.

Other teams put out academy front rowers if there's injuries.
Shouldn't bend the rules for this ****.

sounds fine doesn't it, but is it realistic. Not in any sort of quality. They've mentioned the alternative, but only dismissively as a joke. There's a world that separates the Toulon espoirs and then the guys that win win win...they're going to have to juggle with their roster, Barcella has played on the right of the scrum before although he's old now and only does well on the left.
And Laporte is condemning exactly that: he's got two youngsters to play at hooker and TH for the entire match, he's afraid if anything goes wrong for them he'll have that on his conscience. So reaching for even more young and tender isn't happening..

 

[TRF_Olyy]

If Toulon pull out is it ruled as a 50-0 walkover to the opposition?

 

[nickdnz]

not relevant in the least measure here, he's part of the absences as he's injured..."like always", haha...right, he's been notorious for that hasn't he. Are you just now confusing Bernard Laporte and owner Mourad Boudjellal ??...And yes it's his and Toulon's problem and not anyone else's, that much is clear ... (??...).
Actually it's Castres' also, the team they should go to next weekend, as there's a show to insure and Toulon coming to town generates a lot of revenue and excitement.

There's no need to get into the old "they knew from the start what issues they'd run into", I mean SEVEN absences in your front row. Seven.
- Chilachava, their TH choice after Hayman (injured) was trained in the Toulon academies and now Georgia are picking him for int'ls. Castro gets suspended. That's TH.
- Now Guirado is a French int'l, no problem, but Burden who was an amazing find they weren't using at all in SA gets injured just last week, that's hookers.
- And Chiocci - Menini are now both picked at LH for France (academy trained and born in Toulon - revived in Toulon last year got selected since, respectively).

He's got a French Tighthead from Pro D2 and a young but regular homegrown Toulonais hooker now, THAT'S IT, for the match. The concern is real.

Well I was referring to his comments in regards to PSA's complaints about the Top 14's fielding of international players (which I agree with his statements of hypocrisy, and he does seem to be taking in more French players, but as a coach he is quite reactionary) - as well as Toulon's position in general.

Maybe I would be more sympathetic to his situation, if the Wellington Lions didn't lose their first choice 1st 5/8th in preseason and then go through five additional 1st 5/8ths (including a school kid) in the regular season - to lose 9/10 matches and get relegated (while getting none of their international players). It's unfortunate and extreme, but it's a reality everyone has to deal with. Surely he could bring in players as medical jokers? What happened to old man Barcella?

 

[FrenchFan]

Bluff.Bluff. Bluff.

Everybody's falling for it. He can't not show up.

Toulouse have been in that situation how many times over the last ehm 20 odd years?!

When Laporte was plundering our club for les Bleus, Noves never threatened to withdraw for a league game. WHAT A LAUGH!!!

Toulouse this season have signed pro contract to 4 front rowers from the academy. Cyrille Baille 20 Julien Marchand 19 in particular have been outstanding for us in Top 14. Didn't hear anyone whinging about fielding young players esp. when these youngsters show they'll soon be better than the older guys (that includes Toulon's older guys...)

Toulon are afraid to field youngsters in case they get injured :cryy:

Here's your front line Bernard : Bastareau 1- Bastagros 2 -Basta 3.

Nice bit of bluff Bernard...

 

[tituslechmakus]

Well, I also consider it as bluff, but maybe it is a good thing to make things change as we are the only country with authorities not being concerned by the National team. Laporte has to deal with the rules taking place at the moment. When he was French coach, he had to deal with these same problems ! I'm sure he was hearing about Noves complaints but could not do much to help ... He had to be competitiv with France ! Not sure he would complain if

So the only ones to blame here are the LNR and FFR for this very bad managment of the top 14 schedule !

 

[FrenchFan]

Well, I also consider it as bluff, but maybe it is a good thing to make things change as we are the only country with authorities not being concerned by the National team. Laporte has to deal with the rules taking place at the moment. When he was French coach, he had to deal with these same problems ! I'm sure he was hearing about Noves complaints but could not do much to help ... He had to be competitiv with France ! Not sure he would complain if

So the only ones to blame here are the LNR and FFR for this very bad managment of the top 14 schedule !

Sorry Noves never threatened a no-show for a league game.

Laporte is making a show of himself. And he should be thankful to Noves and Toulouse. If he was reasonably successful with les Bleus it was thanks to no small part from our players.

 

[tituslechmakus]

Sorry Noves never threatened a no-show for a league game.

Laporte is making a show of himself. And he should be thankful to Noves and Toulouse. If he was reasonably successful with les Bleus it was thanks to no small part from our players.

That is totally true ! But I do not think Laporte is not conscious of it ! And you can also admit that we've had the past 10-15 seasons of Noves complaining all the time about these "doublons" ! They are both right.

I know a lot of people in French rugby do not like Laporte, but in this case, isn't he trying to make things change with the only things he can affect directly ? He cannot force the LNR/FFR to change, so he tries everything in his possibilities !?
I would like him to be the next president of FFR, as he knows what it is to manage a club and a National team, on the contrary to these ****** leading our authorities ! They only know how do open the spirits cupboard (l'armoire à gnole)

 

[Big Ewis]

here @TRF_nickdnz, have a mention ! How odd it is I would be your first...:flirt:

Ah "reactionary", he most certainly is our Nanard ! Barcella has been Toulonized, meaning they took him out of obscurity (like other fellow Biarritz LH Menini) and he's now looking revitalized and relevant again. He's not the monster he once was (albeit his peak was ephemeral) in the scrum but he can hold his own quite well still and he's still a handful in the loose. Got a nice big turnover at the breakdown against Ulster the other day...

As for you other jealous ninja turtle panda bears, yes of course it's bluff. It's Bernard Laporte is always over stating things and exaggerating. But "making a show of himself", no. He's a comedian, a Mediterranean, he loves to make things dramatic but he doesn't talk shiit though there's always truth in the bulk of his comments. He's got 7 fkng absences in the front row guys, he's got ONE hooker and ONE 4th choice TH fresh from Pro D2. That's not exactly a classic case in any league, of any era, it's just immensely back luck.
Could've been prevented ? Again, for national duty only Chiocci, Menini, Guirado and Chilachava (newly, and a local product) out.

 

[Jbobo]

Bernard Laporte threatened to withdrawal for the next Toulon match in Castres because he only has 1 professional prop and hooker, due to injuries, suspensions and international November tests. He would be forced to use youth players, who never played at professional level. He said he fears so much major injuries for these guys that he prefers to withdrawal. .

It's his own stupid fault.

 

[Big Ewis]

3 Espoirs from the academy join Toulon for the weekend on the way to Castres. Young Frenchmen LH, TH and hooker. That'll be interesting !...

This is exactly what Laporte and Boudjellal feared, importing those youngsters as the level is so different from espoirs to pro, and there's a risk they'll get injured because of that. We'll see, for me this is totally awesome, we get to see just what these guys can do.
Toulon sure are lucky it's Castres (whose front row is decimated also) and not Slimani and Stade Français

 

[TRF_Olyy]

3
This is exactly what Laporte and Boudjellal feared, importing those youngsters as the level is so different from espoirs to pro, and there's a risk they'll get injured because of that.

That's BS. There's a risk of anyone playing rugby getting injured.
Academy players getting their chances during times of international callups/injuries happens all of the time.

Look at the players in the premiership who got their shots due to it: Cowan-Dickie, Sinckler, Thomas, Taylor etc.etc.etc.
Did them no harm to get exposure to the top level.


Hell, Sale in the past have put out almost entire academy tight 5s, plus bench, due to injuries - we didn't threaten to cancel the game due to it.

 

[j'nuh]

Have Toulon run out of money for medical jokers?

 

[Big Ewis]

That's BS. There's a risk of anyone playing rugby getting injured.
Academy players getting their chances during times of international callups/injuries happens all of the time.

Look at the players in the premiership who got their shots due to it: Cowan-Dickie, Sinckler, Thomas, Taylor etc.etc.etc.
Did them no harm to get exposure to the top level.


Hell, Sale in the past have put out almost entire academy tight 5s, plus bench, due to injuries - we didn't threaten to cancel the game due to it.

Well speaking of BS, that's coz Sale doesn't win its league, does it. In the Top 14 you lose one game at home, you're out basically. When you see La fukkng Rochelle putting 40 past Tier 1 Top 14 clubs, you start to get the kind of environment it is. Toulon need to stay ahead and get all the points they can, and because their ambitions are so elite, that includes wins away too, which they've acquired already. They only now got to the top of the table, which is late for them, and one faux pas and they're below their biggest rival Clermont, and possibly others. They've fielded local homegrown products and that's good enough imo but they could've had all int'ls (foreigner, or French). They can't fk around, not that single time even. Their culture of win-it-allness and sheer excellence won't allow a single slip, they can't just field 3rd stringers in the front row throughout and academy espoirs ? That's just bunkers, there's a world of difference in level.

Go see Laporte, look at him in the whites of the eyes and tell him "Hell, Sale put out academy tight 5s you know". I'm sure he'll take that notion very much at heart.

 

[TheSaffycen]

Look at the Tigers this year. Mulipola, Ayerza, Rizzo, Ghiraldini, Cole, Youngs (all front rows) Parling, Kitchener, Slater, Deacon (All Locks) Matera, Croft, Barbieri (Back Rows) Tuilagi, Allen, Bai, Loamanu(all centres) Morris, Tait (Both back three) are all unavailable through injury or call ups or have only just come back. They win their league.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Well speaking of BS, that's coz Sale doesn't win its league, does it.

Absolutely and completely beside the point.
Laporte claims it's too dangerous, not that they're not good enough.
You don't see Tigers calling off games because they're missing pretty much all of their starters and they'd lose games as a result.
Bath aren't cancelling because they're having to put out college kids in their backrow, with all of their injuries there.


We're actually in agreement, I guess. Laporte knows that it's not "too dangerous" to field these players, it's that he's scared he's going to lose the games, in which case: Boo hoo hoo, cry more.

 

[Big Ewis]

what do you want me to say to that ? Good for them, a number of Top 14 teams have been far into the playoffs without many of their bigger names. And I don't know the Tigers and their conditions, but if those are all first choices and you're telling me they won the Prem with an exclusively second string squad then yes I'll tip my hat to them for sure !
Not possible in the Top 14, especially not today. One match is a lot for Toulon, just one single match; especially after a few traumas early in the year. Losing at home to Paris was bad. In the animation of the game, they've lost Wilkinson, Giteau and Michalak in the past 4 months. They had 3 guys take the shots from the tee in recent matches, leaving a ton of points in the dust. That's not Toulon. Those are not the ways of a triple champion in two seasons. You can beat around the topic, it won't change this very fundamental truth about who they are.