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New Biennial Global tournament from 2026

They have not given control to sanzaar and 6n during June/July and end of year windows have they? In fact that is precisely when they've said the world league games will be played. So I don't understand what additional control they've given anyone. What am I not getting?
Sorry, missed the notification for your reply. It would appear they have, because the 6N/SANZAAR are able to convert those windows to exclusively be fixtures that they agree to (i.e. against other hand picked opposition in the World League). At least at present we have Italy forced to play Georgia last year (that is the last team in the solar system Italy will have wanted to play) and likely forced Italy to play sides like Uruguay and Romania.

In your defence and my defence, the communication around this from 6N/SANZAAR and World Rugby is poor.

Will there still be Tier1 vs Tier2 fixtures in non-World League years?
Is there an actual cast iron commitment to promotion/relegation in 2030?
Is there any set criteria on who the two invited teams will be?
Can any of the invitees be from Europe?
Will the Asia Pacific Americas Cup (APAC) still be happening from 2024 onwards and will it tie into who the invitees are?
Will the World League invitees be invited into TRC?

The lack of clarity on any of the above and the surprise announcement that World Rugby will not be overseeing the World League top division (just as they do not oversee the 6N or TRC) speaks volumes to me that the answers to the above are more likely to be negative for Tier2 than if World Rugby were overseeing the rules and membership of the World League top division.

I suspect WR will run the 2nd division of the World League and 6N/SANZAAR will simply ignore it.
 
Well, bill Beaumont pretty much said that the reason for the world league is precisely to take back control so they can promote the game below tier 1 by having promotion relegation because they can't enforce this in 6 nations or rugby championship as they have no control over those comps.
this is why...and ive said it loads of time...just make every team have to qualify for the world cup, that will force T1 nations to play several T2/3 nations at least twice every four years...actually use the competition they have control over to grow the game
 
this is why...and ive said it loads of time...just make every team have to qualify for the world cup, that will force T1 nations to play several T2/3 nations at least twice every four years...actually use the competition they have control over to grow the game
Absolutely. But this requires the interests of World Rugby to be different from 6N/SANZAAR, whereas I would argue these interests are all completely aligned with the current administration. Nobody wants to 'grow the game' if it means risking a short term hit to the finances of a Tier1 union or dilutes Tier1 control over the World Rugby Council (where RWC qualification is one of the variables on how many votes you get).
 
this is why...and ive said it loads of time...just make every team have to qualify for the world cup, that will force T1 nations to play several T2/3 nations at least twice every four years...actually use the competition they have control over to grow the game
I kinda agree about qualification, but only kinda; I also absolutely hate the propsed new biennial tourney. So I'll take on the role of devil's advocate...

IIRC it used to be only the top 3 who qualified automatically for the next RWC.
I certainly remember England going through qualifying ahead of the 1999 RWC - so before professionalism was properly embedded in rugby.
It was frankly dangerous.

How much did anyone learn about routing the Netherlands 100+ to 0 without even trying (IIRC Jason Leonard specifically said that they were holding back a the scrum, maul and tackle, specifically to avoid hurting anyone)? How much did that increase rugby's appeal in the Netherlands? IIRC there was significant pressure (might even have been a semi-compulsory thing) to play their first XV, to avoid being disrespectful.

How far down the rugby pyramid of a country like England or South Africa (can you imagine them taking on the 6th best team on the African continent, and not hurting anyone?), before it's safe, but a guaranteed win for the tier 1 country who aren't about to sacrifice RWC qualification. What would be the benefits of such a match?

Tier 1 against Tier 2 - yeah, okay, they should be able to handle it (and even playing devil's advocate, I want to see more of those matches); Depending on where you put the tiers, then the same goes for Tier 2 against tier 3.
But tier 1 against Tier 3... I can't see that being safe, interesting, or anything worth encouraging.


IMO, and not playing devil's advocate - I'd rather see an expanded RWC, with a 2nd tier RWC below it (IIRC, England bid something similar for 2007, but lost?)
a Tier 2&3 RWC, with 8 pools of 4. Pool winners play off, then the top 4 have a couple of weeks off, then go through to the RWC "proper" with 4 pools of 6 (even numbers make scheduling so much easier).

Plenty of tricky bits with that though - like who qualifies for which, and... that's getting a lot of time off work for the amateurs (those those going through the RWC Jr will be helluva match sharp before taking on the big boys)
 
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I think the tier 2 and 3 teams would learn a lot cycle to cycle about the progress they had made.

I do think the scrums could be an issue, winning 15 scrum penalties a game would be ridiculous.

Europe gets 8 spots plus playoff. Has to be a way for the final round of qualifying to be six nations plus RESC teams. Make the RESC teams qualify for that round but teams can get bye to final qualifying round based on previous World Cup.

Even having Ireland or England trot out an amateur XV for qualification (essentially what USA does in basketball) would be good for other nations.
 
I kinda agree about qualification, but only kinda; I also absolutely hate the propsed new biennial tourney. So I'll take on the role of devil's advocate...

IIRC it used to be only the top 3 who qualified automatically for the next RWC.
I certainly remember England going through qualifying ahead of the 1999 RWC - so before professionalism was properly embedded in rugby.
It was frankly dangerous.

How much did anyone learn about routing the Netherlands 100+ to 0 without even trying (IIRC Jason Leonard specifically said that they were holding back a the scrum, maul and tackle, specifically to avoid hurting anyone)? How much did that increase rugby's appeal in the Netherlands? IIRC there was significant pressure (might even have been a semi-compulsory thing) to play their first XV, to avoid being disrespectful.

How far down the rugby pyramid of a country like England or South Africa (can you imagine them taking on the 6th best team on the African continent, and not hurting anyone?), before it's safe, but a guaranteed win for the tier 1 country who aren't about to sacrifice RWC qualification. What would be the benefits of such a match?

Tier 1 against Tier 2 - yeah, okay, they should be able to handle it (and even playing devil's advocate, I want to see more of those matches); Depending on where you put the tiers, then the same goes for Tier 2 against tier 3.
But tier 1 against Tier 3... I can't see that being safe, interesting, or anything worth encouraging.


IMO, and not playing devil's advocate - I'd rather see an expanded RWC, with a 2nd tier RWC below it (IIRC, England bid something similar for 2007, but lost?)
a Tier 2&3 RWC, with 8 pools of 4. Pool winners play off, then the top 4 have a couple of weeks off, then go through to the RWC "proper" with 4 pools of 6 (even numbers make scheduling so much easier).

Plenty of tricky bits with that though - like who qualifies for which, and... that's getting a lot of time off work for the amateurs (those those going through the RWC Jr will be helluva match sharp before taking on the big boys)
i'll try and read through again as there are lots of points there

im surprised, i never thought there was real qualifying, i dont remember NZ doing it before 1999 for example

i get what your saying but one of the things id really be driving for with qualifying is bringing the best players (at least some of the best) to these countries, the idea is to grow interest at home rather than reading in the paper your country went and played in a WC for a sport you barely knew existed last week

scrum penalties are a real pet peeve of mine, i dont think we should be penilising a team for not being as string or technically good as the other team, so a change in how thats officiated would help at least to a small degree

the reality is we need to do something and trying to milk the existing big nations aint gonna work for ever....but this is also pie in the sky stuff so theres only so much i can be bothered working out details
 
I kinda agree about qualification, but only kinda; I also absolutely hate the propsed new biennial tourney. So I'll take on the role of devil's advocate...

IIRC it used to be only the top 3 who qualified automatically for the next RWC.
I certainly remember England going through qualifying ahead of the 1999 RWC - so before professionalism was properly embedded in rugby.
It was frankly dangerous.

How much did anyone learn about routing the Netherlands 100+ to 0 without even trying (IIRC Jason Leonard specifically said that they were holding back a the scrum, maul and tackle, specifically to avoid hurting anyone)? How much did that increase rugby's appeal in the Netherlands? IIRC there was significant pressure (might even have been a semi-compulsory thing) to play their first XV, to avoid being disrespectful.

How far down the rugby pyramid of a country like England or South Africa (can you imagine them taking on the 6th best team on the African continent, and not hurting anyone?), before it's safe, but a guaranteed win for the tier 1 country who aren't about to sacrifice RWC qualification. What would be the benefits of such a match?

Tier 1 against Tier 2 - yeah, okay, they should be able to handle it (and even playing devil's advocate, I want to see more of those matches); Depending on where you put the tiers, then the same goes for Tier 2 against tier 3.
But tier 1 against Tier 3... I can't see that being safe, interesting, or anything worth encouraging.


IMO, and not playing devil's advocate - I'd rather see an expanded RWC, with a 2nd tier RWC below it (IIRC, England bid something similar for 2007, but lost?)
a Tier 2&3 RWC, with 8 pools of 4. Pool winners play off, then the top 4 have a couple of weeks off, then go through to the RWC "proper" with 4 pools of 6 (even numbers make scheduling so much easier).

Plenty of tricky bits with that though - like who qualifies for which, and... that's getting a lot of time off work for the amateurs (those those going through the RWC Jr will be helluva match sharp before taking on the big boys)
Just to play devils advocate to your devils advocate, how is having 4 pools of 6 in the World Cup any different to requiring tier 1 to play tier 3 before the World Cup? Honestly I think 4 pools of five is too much. Last time I watched every game, but this time I don't think I'll be bothered with watching any of the games involving the 5th top teams in each pool or the 4th top in pool A except when they play NZ.

Ignoring logistics, What would be fun is if, outside world cups, tier 1 had obligations to play their second team against lower tiers and then if the lower team wins they earn the right to play the top team.
 
A] I'm surprised, i never thought there was real qualifying, i dont remember NZ doing it before 1999 for example

B]
I get what your saying but one of the things id really be driving for with qualifying is bringing the best players (at least some of the best) to these countries, the idea is to grow interest at home rather than reading in the paper your country went and played in a WC for a sport you barely knew existed last week

C] Scrum penalties are a real pet peeve of mine, i dont think we should be penilising a team for not being as string or technically good as the other team, so a change in how thats officiated would help at least to a small degree

D] The reality is we need to do something and trying to milk the existing big nations aint gonna work for ever....but this is also pie in the sky stuff so theres only so much i can be bothered working out details
A] NZ have never finished low enough in the previous RWC to need to qualify.
Out of interest, and with insomnia tonight, I've had a look. in '91 and '95 the 8 QFs automatically qualified (+ hosts in '95). So it was only for '99 that had the reduced numbers (previous top 3, and Wales as official hosts). NZ were obviously finalists from '95. Australia, England, Ireland & Scotland all went through qualifying (yes, Scotland were good back then). If interested, here's who played whom: Europe, Oceania

B] I'm not convinced that that would help (especially whilst playing devil's advocate) - I'm genuinely not convinced that it would help the sport as a whole by more to play in front of 100 people in Copenghagen, instead of 80,000 in Cardiff.

C] Agreed entirely, not sure the relevance to this discussion, but I absolutely agree.

D] Again, I agree entirely, and I absolutely detest the "tournament" that this thread is dedicated to. But I don't think that the walk-overs and injuries implicit in this thread tangent is the answer. Also agreed in not working out the details for an alternative that's never going to happen (not unless it really piques my interest, anyway).

A] Just to play devils advocate to your devils advocate, how is having 4 pools of 6 in the World Cup any different to requiring tier 1 to play tier 3 before the World Cup? Honestly I think 4 pools of five is too much.

B] Last time I watched every game, but this time I don't think I'll be bothered with watching any of the games involving the 5th top teams in each pool or the 4th top in pool A except when they play NZ.

C] Ignoring logistics, What would be fun is if, outside world cups, tier 1 had obligations to play their second team against lower tiers and then if the lower team wins they earn the right to play the top team.
A] I guess it depends on where you put the break between tiers; so I just looked at the current set-up, and increased it a bit. Of course, currently, all qualifying teams get a LOT of WR help to improve them before the RWC happens. TBH, my ideal for just about any cup tournament is 4 pools of 4 - but with the RWC already being complained about for locking out less lights, I didn't that reducing it would fly.

B] I will, but I guess the time-zones make it much less of a chore for me to do so. Having said that, I don't recall missing anything other than the pointless 3rd place play-off from any RWC since graduating - even if a reasonably number were watched "as live" later, with judicious use of the "skip forward 1 minute" button.

C] I loved the old Churchill Cup - but IIRC it failed because USA and Canada didn't want to play everyone else's second teams, and demanded to play first XVs, even though they couldn't beat the 2nd XVs. Whilst I love the idea of that, and I love the idea of sending 2nd XVs out to tour Tier 2 nations whilst the big boys have their main tours; it seems like it's a solution that only the big boys (and not all of them) actually like, whilst the Tier 2 teams feel condescended to by the idea. I'd suggest that as the Tier 2 teams are getting ever more exposure to each other, it may also be harder for them to fit such a tour into their schedule as well.
 
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A] NZ have never finished low enough in the previous RWC to need to qualify.
Out of interest, and with insomnia tonight, I've had a look. in '91 and '95 the 8 QFs automatically qualified (+ hosts in '95). So it was only for '99 that had the reduced numbers (previous top 3, and Wales as official hosts). NZ were obviously finalists from '95. Australia, England, Ireland & Scotland all went through qualifying (yes, Scotland were good back then). If interested, here's who played whom: Europe, Oceania

B] I'm not convinced that that would help (especially whilst playing devil's advocate) - I'm genuinely not convinced that it would help the sport as a whole by more to play in front of 100 people in Copenghagen, instead of 80,000 in Cardiff.

C] Agreed entirely, not sure the relevance to this discussion, but I absolutely agree.

D] Again, I agree entirely, and I absolutely detest the "tournament" that this thread is dedicated to. But I don't think that the walk-overs and injuries implicit in this thread tangent is the answer. Also agreed in not working out the details for an alternative that's never going to happen (not unless it really piques my interest, anyway).


A] I guess it depends on where you put the break between tiers; so I just looked at the current set-up, and increased it a bit. Of course, currently, all qualifying teams get a LOT of WR help to improve them before the RWC happens. TBH, my ideal for just about any cup tournament is 4 pools of 4 - but with the RWC already being complained about for locking out less lights, I didn't that reducing it would fly.

B] I will, but I guess the time-zones make it much less of a chore for me to do so. Having said that, I don't recall missing anything other than the pointless 3rd place play-off from any RWC since graduating - even if a reasonably number were watched "as live" later, with judicious use of the "skip forward 1 minute" button.

C] I loved the old Churchill Cup - but IIRC it failed because USA and Canada didn't want to play everyone else's second teams, and demanded to play first XVs, even though they couldn't beat the 2nd XVs. Whilst I love the idea of that, and I love the idea of sending 2nd XVs out to tour Tier 2 nations whilst the big boys have their main tours; it seems like it's a solution that only the big boys (and not all of them) actually like, whilst the Tier 2 teams feel condescended to by the idea. I'd suggest that as the Tier 2 teams are getting ever more exposure to each other, it may also be harder for them to fit such a tour into their schedule as well.
B] both...not instead, its a similar argument when the PI nations play in NZ, that gets more money in but doesnt grow the sport back home, that why its home and away, you play the big game in wales or auckland or capetown...and then the "revenge" match in copenhagen or Apia or Harare, we actually put some effort into marketing spin to get these countries in the gate

C] that was poorly quotes on my part, i thought someone mentioned top teams just raking up hundreds of scrum penalties and i just thought we could make it easier for these emerging countries to compete if there wasn;t that avenue to take them out of the game

my personal preference is for the RWC proper to be a real show piece and compact enough that people will keep travelling to watch it, two big and people wont be able to take 5 or 6 weeks of to follow their team around....but move some of the importance around the RWC to games in the lead up

Maybe the qualification is only part of it, maybe this is how we do the seedings in which case smaller teams might play important roles in these matches with these like points differentials, NZ needs to win by 30 to be seeded #1 so they have to send a full strength squad to apia
 
B] both...not instead, its a similar argument when the PI nations play in NZ, that gets more money in but doesnt grow the sport back home, that why its home and away, you play the big game in wales or auckland or capetown...and then the "revenge" match in copenhagen or Apia or Harare, we actually put some effort into marketing spin to get these countries in the gate
I really don't want to get bogged down in this, especially as I'm mostly playing devil's advocate; but... I don't see how either of those matches makes money, nor how either grows the game - especially as, to fit them in, you've got to sacrifice the big pay-day match at the big stadium, and a competitive match at the smaller.

To take a random (extreme) example, the Danes don't learn anything from shipping 100+ points to England (or England A, or England U20s), and it'll be a non-event. Twickenham wouldn't sell that out even if they gave away 2/3 of the tickets to schools for free.
Novelty might get an extra 100 bums on seats in Copenhagen, but actual interest, and press coverage etc would be nothing like for a close(ish) game against the likes of Norway or Finland, with whom they have a historical rivalry, and similar quality of team.
So the European bias would be that there are too many teams, with too great a discrepancy in quality/interest to be "worth" doing it, and existing tournaments for the top 35+ teams already (ranked from 13 to 100 + 3NR); so there's no "need" for a load of walk-overs just to show that yes, the 5th best team in the world is better than the 55th best.

In Africa, there's just the one big team, who aren't worth putting into the draw, and who would represent an actual danger to (most of) the others - try putting the Boks up against Madagascar!
And again, there's an existing tournament for the next best 16 teams (ranking from 22 to 95 + 1NR) and historically, South Africa entered an amateur team 4 times, winning the ***le 3 times.

In the Americas, there's just the one big team, who aren't worth putting into the draw, and again, there's an existing tournament. This time, there probably wouldn't be all that much danger (due to the quality of opposition); but Argentina do put in a lesser XV; with a W-D-L ratio of 31-2-1. But then, there's only 5 other nations taking part (ranked 12 to 29).

In Oceana, there's the Pacific Nations Cup; and RWC qualification is based around whether 1 of them (usually Tonga) can get through the repêchage of RWC qualification; not whether any of them can keep All Blacks honest, and certainly not whether the Cook Islands would stand a hope against the ABs. The rankings covered by the PNC are 10-15; none of who are realistically in injury danger from playing against one of the big boys; and all of whom are professional.
I'm surprised to find there's no Jr version of the PNC with Cook Islands, PNG etc - well, technically there is, but it only seems to consist of 3 teams at the bottom of the rankings, and none from the mid-table - surely I'm missing something.

Even in Asia, there's a tournie for not-Japan; covering 20 teams (ranked 24 to 94 + 7NR).



Surely, the point of qualification rounds for a world cup, is to ensure that the best teams are at the world cup.
It's been decided that 20 teams contest it.
The question isn't whether the top 10 countries should be there, but exactly who the next best 10 are.
Pitting anyone from the top 10 against anyone from the 3rd or 4th set of 10 is... pointless (playing DA; "pointless in terms of deciding if they're better team" if not), let alone top 10 against the 5th-10th set of 10 (which opens the question of how far down the pyramid do you want to see a qualification tournament to reach the RWC?)

ETA: Dammit! I think I just failed to avoid getting bogged down
 
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Which 12 countries are likely to make up division two of this World League?

Going by the current world rankings I guess it would be:
Georgia, Samoa, Tonga, USA, Canada, Uruguay, Chile, Namibia, Hong Kong China, Romania, Spain and Portugal.

Will there be any pathway for the likes of The Netherlands, Brazil, Korea or Zimbabwe to break into this division?
 
Which 12 countries are likely to make up division two of this World League?

Going by the current world rankings I guess it would be:
Georgia, Samoa, Tonga, USA, Canada, Uruguay, Chile, Namibia, Hong Kong China, Romania, Spain and Portugal.

Will there be any pathway for the likes of The Netherlands, Brazil, Korea or Zimbabwe to break into this division?
We have no details on that either that I am aware of. Presumably it would be ranking related or with some kind of playoff. We don't even know if it would have regional quotas for each continent. I think they can iron out these details and do not suspect there would be anything underhand with this.

Personally, I would be happy enough with rankings as long as there a regional/continental tournaments to help the nations you mention above have the chance to claim ranking points off teams in the WL 2nd division.
 
A] NZ have never finished low enough in the previous RWC to need to qualify.
Out of interest, and with insomnia tonight, I've had a look. in '91 and '95 the 8 QFs automatically qualified (+ hosts in '95). So it was only for '99 that had the reduced numbers (previous top 3, and Wales as official hosts). NZ were obviously finalists from '95. Australia, England, Ireland & Scotland all went through qualifying (yes, Scotland were good back then). If interested, here's who played whom: Europe, Oceania

B] I'm not convinced that that would help (especially whilst playing devil's advocate) - I'm genuinely not convinced that it would help the sport as a whole by more to play in front of 100 people in Copenghagen, instead of 80,000 in Cardiff.

C] Agreed entirely, not sure the relevance to this discussion, but I absolutely agree.

D] Again, I agree entirely, and I absolutely detest the "tournament" that this thread is dedicated to. But I don't think that the walk-overs and injuries implicit in this thread tangent is the answer. Also agreed in not working out the details for an alternative that's never going to happen (not unless it really piques my interest, anyway).


A] I guess it depends on where you put the break between tiers; so I just looked at the current set-up, and increased it a bit. Of course, currently, all qualifying teams get a LOT of WR help to improve them before the RWC happens. TBH, my ideal for just about any cup tournament is 4 pools of 4 - but with the RWC already being complained about for locking out less lights, I didn't that reducing it would fly.

B] I will, but I guess the time-zones make it much less of a chore for me to do so. Having said that, I don't recall missing anything other than the pointless 3rd place play-off from any RWC since graduating - even if a reasonably number were watched "as live" later, with judicious use of the "skip forward 1 minute" button.

C] I loved the old Churchill Cup - but IIRC it failed because USA and Canada didn't want to play everyone else's second teams, and demanded to play first XVs, even though they couldn't beat the 2nd XVs. Whilst I love the idea of that, and I love the idea of sending 2nd XVs out to tour Tier 2 nations whilst the big boys have their main tours; it seems like it's a solution that only the big boys (and not all of them) actually like, whilst the Tier 2 teams feel condescended to by the idea. I'd suggest that as the Tier 2 teams are getting ever more exposure to each other, it may also be harder for them to fit such a tour into their schedule as well.
A) Agree on only 16 teams to RWC, but limit automatic qualification to final 4, then split the 12 places to 6 to Euro/Africa, 4 to Oceania/Asia and 2 to The Americas.
That way more T1 teams would have to play top T2 teams in competitive matches.
 
A) Agree on only 16 teams to RWC, but limit automatic qualification to final 4, then split the 12 places to 6 to Euro/Africa, 4 to Oceania/Asia and 2 to The Americas.
That way more T1 teams would have to play top T2 teams in competitive matches.
For example in Euro/Africa there could be 2 groups of 5 with the top 3 qualifying
A)England, Italy, Georgia, Romania, Namibia
B) Scotland, Wales, Spain, Portugal, ???
 
I really don't want to get bogged down in this, especially as I'm mostly playing devil's advocate; but... I don't see how either of those matches makes money, nor how either grows the game - especially as, to fit them in, you've got to sacrifice the big pay-day match at the big stadium, and a competitive match at the smaller.

To take a random (extreme) example, the Danes don't learn anything from shipping 100+ points to England (or England A, or England U20s), and it'll be a non-event. Twickenham wouldn't sell that out even if they gave away 2/3 of the tickets to schools for free.
Novelty might get an extra 100 bums on seats in Copenhagen, but actual interest, and press coverage etc would be nothing like for a close(ish) game against the likes of Norway or Finland, with whom they have a historical rivalry, and similar quality of team.
So the European bias would be that there are too many teams, with too great a discrepancy in quality/interest to be "worth" doing it, and existing tournaments for the top 35+ teams already (ranked from 13 to 100 + 3NR); so there's no "need" for a load of walk-overs just to show that yes, the 5th best team in the world is better than the 55th best.

In Africa, there's just the one big team, who aren't worth putting into the draw, and who would represent an actual danger to (most of) the others - try putting the Boks up against Madagascar!
And again, there's an existing tournament for the next best 16 teams (ranking from 22 to 95 + 1NR) and historically, South Africa entered an amateur team 4 times, winning the ***le 3 times.

In the Americas, there's just the one big team, who aren't worth putting into the draw, and again, there's an existing tournament. This time, there probably wouldn't be all that much danger (due to the quality of opposition); but Argentina do put in a lesser XV; with a W-D-L ratio of 31-2-1. But then, there's only 5 other nations taking part (ranked 12 to 29).

In Oceana, there's the Pacific Nations Cup; and RWC qualification is based around whether 1 of them (usually Tonga) can get through the repêchage of RWC qualification; not whether any of them can keep All Blacks honest, and certainly not whether the Cook Islands would stand a hope against the ABs. The rankings covered by the PNC are 10-15; none of who are realistically in injury danger from playing against one of the big boys; and all of whom are professional.
I'm surprised to find there's no Jr version of the PNC with Cook Islands, PNG etc - well, technically there is, but it only seems to consist of 3 teams at the bottom of the rankings, and none from the mid-table - surely I'm missing something.

Even in Asia, there's a tournie for not-Japan; covering 20 teams (ranked 24 to 94 + 7NR).



Surely, the point of qualification rounds for a world cup, is to ensure that the best teams are at the world cup.
It's been decided that 20 teams contest it.
The question isn't whether the top 10 countries should be there, but exactly who the next best 10 are.
Pitting anyone from the top 10 against anyone from the 3rd or 4th set of 10 is... pointless (playing DA; "pointless in terms of deciding if they're better team" if not), let alone top 10 against the 5th-10th set of 10 (which opens the question of how far down the pyramid do you want to see a qualification tournament to reach the RWC?)

ETA: Dammit! I think I just failed to avoid getting bogged down
i cant even make my way through all of that sorry

all i'll say is i fell you're underestimating how many people just want to see their team play...and even better if theyre playing the best in the world. Regardless of the result

In football the All Whites are a minow....but we'll fill a stadium to see them get beat by brazil...because you get to watch your guys and the best at the same time

my personal feeling is this obsession with only the best playing the best is whats slowly killing rugby. The EXISTING TOURNAMENT can be for the best of the best...but we can use the tiny hope of playing in that tournament to raise some interest in new markets

We may have to just agree to disagree...but im firmly in the realm of trying to make sure rugby survives and well past worrying about making sure each game is a big pay day
 
Women's rugby have jyst announced fixtures for their equivalent competition.

Makes far more sense and creates jeopardy in 6N, while also goving T2 more opportunities.

Maybe having a regional championship followed by a Confederations Trophy in the 4 year cycle would work.

Using the women's idea, the top 3 from a Euro/Africa Champs, top 2 from Asia/Oceania and winner of Americas could be in Div1, repeat for div 2 and div 3, then beneath that would be qualifiers for the next regional champs.
 
Women's rugby have jyst announced fixtures for their equivalent competition.

Makes far more sense and creates jeopardy in 6N, while also goving T2 more opportunities.

Maybe having a regional championship followed by a Confederations Trophy in the 4 year cycle would work.

Using the women's idea, the top 3 from a Euro/Africa Champs, top 2 from Asia/Oceania and winner of Americas could be in Div1, repeat for div 2 and div 3, then beneath that would be qualifiers for the next regional champs.
For example, using current WR.
Div 1A Ireland, France, South Africa
Div 1B NZ, Argentina, Australia
Play at single venue, against teams from other group, 3 matches.

Div 2A Scotland, England, Wales
Div 2B Fiji, Samoa, Uruguay

Div 3A Georgia, Italy, Portugal
Div 3B Japan, Tonga, USA

Euro/Africa qualifying: Romania, Spain, Namibia, Netherlands. Winners qualify for next championship.
 
Georgian coach thinks promotion/relegation would not come in until 2032 (rather than 2030). I am surprised he even thinks it would ever happen.

Desperately pleading to even be included in the u20 6N. Tragic stuff.

 
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