[November Tests 2017 EOYT] France vs. New Zealand (11/11/2017)

[RoosTah]

Its one of the Laws of the game... e.g, why is passing the ball forward an infringement? Because it is; its part of the way the game is played.

Its not the first time I have seen it in pro rugby...

And for this one, ignore the ignorant Irish commentators (who clearly don't know the Law). A try does not need to be a certain or definitive result but for foul play for a penalty try to be awarded. It only has to be probable.

Appreciate you're a ref mate, but whilst I do get it's against the rules I don't think it's an obvious one when you consider the same act 10 meters up the field would have been fine.

SBW won't make that mistake again though that's for sure - just one of those little nuances that go down to the fundamental differences in the philosophies of league and union

 

[smartcooky]

Appreciate you're a ref mate, but whilst I do get it's against the rules I don't think it's an obvious one when you consider the same act 10 meters up the field would have been fine.

No. Its actually a Law that you cannot deliberately propel the ball into touch at all, in any direction, no matter where you are on the field..

10.2 UNFAIR PLAY
(c) Throwing into touch. A player must not intentionally knock, place, push or throw the ball
with his arm or hand into touch, touch-in-goal, or over the dead ball line.
Sanction: Penalty kick on the 15-metre line if the offence is between the 15-metre line and
the touchline, or, at the place of infringement if the offence occured elsewhere in the field
of play, or, 5 metres from the goal line and at least 15 metres from the touchline if the
infringement occured in in-goal.

 

[galumay]

Well at least the 2nd half was less dire to watch! Probably the worst we will see from the AB's this tour.

Poor old SBW, team mates will be giving him heaps tonight!

 

[RoosTah]

[

No. Its actually a Law that you cannot deliberately propel the ball into touch at all, in any direction, no matter where you are on the field..

10.2 UNFAIR PLAY
(c) Throwing into touch. A player must not intentionally knock, place, push or throw the ball
with his arm or hand into touch, touch-in-goal, or over the dead ball line.
Sanction: Penalty kick on the 15-metre line if the offence is between the 15-metre line and
the touchline, or, at the place of infringement if the offence occured elsewhere in the field
of play, or, 5 metres from the goal line and at least 15 metres from the touchline if the
infringement occured in in-goal.

Not if there was an AB player that was close enough to to retrieve it it wouldn't. Either way, think you're heading beyond my basic point here in your technicalities. Just thought you were a bit rough on SBW given that's completely fine in league and the same action in Slightly different circumstances in Union (batting the ball backwards) is completely ok.

No need to cite some other law and highlight it in red for my benefit - that was really all I was getting at before you pulled out the ol rule book.

 

[smartcooky]

Sorry.

The red highlight is just how it appears in the Law book - Red for penalty sanctions, green for free kick sanctions. I just copy/pasted it

 

[NDC89]

Can SBW really use League as much of an excuse any more? He hasn't played it regularly for a while now has he.

 

[JJFlash]

A strange game! Did France really come out in the second half full of intent, or had NZ eased up? A bit of both, maybe. If so, it's very unlike NZ not to have driven in the nail even further and compound France's misery.
Whatever, yet another heavy defeat for France and the LNR & FFR must take their share of the blame (as barthélemy alluded to above).
The ever dominant NZ pack had far too much nous for the French and laid the foundations for the expected win.
What the hell was SBW thinking about patting the ball out of play. Correct me if I'm wrong I believe that putting the ball out of play deliberately with the hands is a penalty offence, and so the penalty try was justified. If SBW had done that against sterner opposition his future in Black could have been in jeopardy.
The one shining light was Antoine Dupont. Imagine what a player he'd be behind a dominant pack.

 

[galumay]

Can SBW really use League as much of an excuse any more? He hasn't played it regularly for a while now has he.

I guess to be fair to the man, I dont believe he has used it as an excuse. Its more a case of us observers suggesting that it was probably an instinctive reaction, under pressure that is perfectly legal in diet rugby but against the laws of rugby.

I guess another possibility is that he simply didnt know that it was not allowed, and presumed he was allowed to knock the ball dead?

 

[BobbyM]

Absolutely the right call for the penalty, and FWIW I think Gardner overall is a really good ref. Seems to communicate well with the players and generally makes the right call. Will be interesting to see how people's views evolve as the less experienced refs (at least at Tier 1 international level) get more time in the middle over these tests!

 

[The Jones Boy]

No. Its actually a Law that you cannot deliberately propel the ball into touch at all, in any direction, no matter where you are on the field..
.

Yes you can.
With any part of your body except your arm or hand.

If SBW had have headed it over the deadball line, no problems, or he could have kicked it over, again no problems, just don't use your arm or hand.

As for having a go at SBW, why don't some of you have a look at the perfectly weighted grubber kick he laid on for Crotty?
Hmmmm...?
There's plenty of life in SBW yet.

 

[galumay]

Yes you can.
With any part of your body except your hand.

LOL! Pedantic, but yes. Seen a few players use their foot to get the ball into touch over the years!

 

[The Jones Boy]

Yeah it was pedantic but so is Cooky, so he can have a bit of his own back. ;-)

 

[Bruce_ma gooshvili]

For UK viewers wanting to see the French and Italian games legally it appears they are shown "as live" following the end of match on Freesporits (Freeview channel 95).

 

[The Jones Boy]

Did you see the hit that SBW copped just after he put his kick through for Crotty?
He got fair whalloped.
He's got some courage that boy.

 

[FrenchFan]

Last Friday in Bordeaux I watched the French Barbarians beat a strong NZ Maoris side in a cracking game. The BaBaas won 19-15. The visiting team put on a terrific haka that seemed to fire up both teams!

The Babaas only had 3 days together before the game. 95% of the team was filled with French players. They were coached by FrankAzema the Clermont coach and captained by Aurélien Rougerie who is 37 yo.

Pick of the players for me were Seb Taofifenua, Swan Rebbadj who has been excellent for Toulon, Jean-Baptiste Dubié and Matthieu Jallibert. Jallibert at 10 just took off from his game v Toulouse where he was excellent for UBB. He's only 18,5. Would also include Romain NTamack of Toulouse who had an excellent game.

I saw more talent leadership and cohesion in the Babaas than anything the FFR team managed last night.

 

[The Jones Boy]

Nice to see Fifita get some more game time. He didn't do himself any harm.

 

[boussduf]

I Wonder if NZ let FR play during 2nd half in order to collect some data about opposent sides.
Does that make sense?

 

[mania]

SBW will not be making that mistake again. glad it happened in a meaningless game.

 

[mania]

I thought gardner had a good game. happy for him to be in charge of these big fixtures

 

[smartcooky]

Yes you can.
With any part of your body except your arm or hand.

If SBW had have headed it over the deadball line, no problems, or he could have kicked it over, again no problems, just don't use your arm or hand.

That is why I posted the actual Law, genius, or did you tune out to the actual relevant part of the post?

As for having a go at SBW, why don't some of you have a look at the perfectly weighted grubber kick he laid on for Crotty?
Hmmmm...?
There's plenty of life in SBW yet.

I have no problems with SBW, I'm a fan, and he offers a lot, but he needs to curb his league instincts such as this one and shoulder charging (which he still does occasionally) That last one got him red-carded and in all likelihood cost us a test match and a series win against the Lions this year.

The real question is, does what he offers as a player outweigh the dumb stuff he does from time to time... only Shag can answer that.