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[2014 Mid-Year Tests] England

I did say injury permitting.

Unless there is a serious bolter leading into the AI games the squad won't change much... So it's not that hard to predict who is likely to go.

The Elite squad announced in August will be the world cup squad.
 
I can't believe people actually want barritt back. Can no one remember how ****e he was at everything apart from defending?

12trees will be our 12 going forward and he will improve. Rightly or wrongly that is what Lancaster will do
 
I can't believe people actually want barritt back. Can no one remember how ****e he was at everything apart from defending?

12trees will be our 12 going forward and he will improve. Rightly or wrongly that is what Lancaster will do

I don't think anyone is saying he should come back into the starting XV per say, just that he might be a different player with a creative ten inside him. Bit that is all hypothetical.

Saw in the news the other day that Lancasyer has asked for extra time before announcing the new EPS in July. He's clearly as confused as us!
 
I don't think anyone is saying he should come back into the starting XV per say, just that he might be a different player with a creative ten inside him. Bit that is all hypothetical.

Saw in the news the other day that Lancasyer has asked for extra time before announcing the new EPS in July. He's clearly as confused as us!

I reckon it will be so he can talk to the clubs, see where guys stand in selection and so on... i mean if, for example say, Eastmond goes back to bath and gets benched like last year he can't really select him in his EPS.
 
I'm glad that Lancaster is having a good think about it because there are still a few areas that need work.

He needs to use lessens learned from New Zealand such as:

Brooke's being a better third choice right head then Thomas.

Haskell being above Tom Johnson in the flanker pecking order.

Which 10s to have in as 2nd and 3rs choice.

12s just a big question mark!

Wingers and who actually is going to be in the squad rather than 30 full backs and 3 wings!

Lots for him to ponder now.

So any bath fans think devoto is better than 12 trees? Ready for international rugby? More than a one trick pony?

Just wondering thoughts as I still see Lancaster possibly looking for other 12 options
 
Devoto has shown a lot of promise - but he's only 20 and not very experienced.

It's a real conundrum having both him and Kyle, because neither should really be benching at premiership level.
I really do not envy the coaching staff this season.
 
Devoto has shown a lot of promise - but he's only 20 and not very experienced.

It's a real conundrum having both him and Kyle, because neither should really be benching at premiership level.
I really do not envy the coaching staff this season.

The age and experience thing isn't an issue for me, but Devoto looks like a 13 to my eyes, even then though he'd be battling it out with Joseph I think he'd be a better playing moving out one.

Midfield options for bath are ludicrously strong - henson, eastmond, devoto, Joesph - potentially Burgess.

Who's your back up 10 now?
 
Devoto considers himself a 10 AFAIK
Eastmond wants to be a 10
Henson will likely be the backup 10
 
Eastmond works as a 10. I can see that.

Don't see it in Devoto - he doesn't really move like one - i don't rate Henson as a 10, i always liked him as 13, but he's almost certainly a 12.
 
Nick Walshe, head coach of the U20s, has moved to Gloucester to be a backs/attack coach.

As a Gloucester fan: Hell ****ing yes. Great achievements with the U20s these last two years. Very good early-years coaching CV.
As an England fan: Dammit. Same reasons as above.

Hopefully it will be to England's benefit that he'll be working with potential stars in Robson, Braley, Minor Burns, Twelvetrees, Purdy, Trinder, May and Sharples.
 
Good move by glous but still find it hard to get excited about them, considering every season for a while they have been a should of team.

Having watch Purdy at Nottingham and Tigers I can understand why we let him go, his hands can go missing at rather silly times.

Have they got a HC yet?
 
Having watch Purdy at Nottingham and Tigers I can understand why we let him go, his hands can go missing at rather silly times.

Yep - good athlete, and good when he gets his hands on the ball... but he's a bit limited other than that.
 
It's not wholely bad for England. It will give Walshe more coaching experience and maybe make him an option for a higher England role in the future. Gods knows we seem to be short on well qualified attack coaches...

I suspect Saints might get ransacked as and when Lancaster goes.
 
Right. So.

I think Stuart Lancaster made some of his worst selection calls this tour and this forums verdict doesn't appear very critical of him.

Not enough has been made of Freddie Burns' selection. I will admit he played fairly well in the first test. But we've only talked about what he did do, rather than what he didn't do. It was apparent from the first moment that Danny Cipriani came on in the first test that he would do the basics as well as Freddie, and also break the line and trouble defences in a way Burns hasn't for some time.

Nothing adds up here and everything leads me to believe that Lancaster and the others only have firm belief in Farrell. If Lancaster believes in Burns as much as his first test selection implies he does, then why go to lengths to keep him off the field for the second test.

Cipriani showed enough in the Crusaders game to merit selection for the final test. He followed this up in the third test off the time bench by creating space for others. Stretching the defence and switching back inside to Tuilagi who almost burst through was an example of something no other 10 has adequately done for this.

Regarding Burns: you can't play yourself back into immediate good form by one decent game against the rusty all Black's side. In the third test he was, to my mind, poor again. He made key mistakes which killed momentum and handed field position, such as the very first kick off and some I'll judged field kicking. Add to this that he wasn't particularly creative and whilst defensively the issues were more systemic than individual, he still floundered on a fee tackles.

Part of a coaches job as selector is to judge when a player is in form and to make the most of it through selection. However, Lancaster wasted the good form of Ford, of Wade, and now of Cipriani because that was the ideal chance to see what the latter could do in current good form. A few people have said they think Cipriani may have done enough to overtake Burns. If that proves correct it will serve as another piece of evidence that Lancaster got it wrong in new Zealand.

Next: the continued selection of Ashton. The latter showed some belief and real commitment in the final test but he wasn't the right choice. Ashton has had more chances than guys like May and Sharples and done more to deserve dropping. That he made an appearance on the bench is proof of an irrational perseverance with Ashton since he's not the right kind of player for the no. 23 shirt. Ashton was put in some tough situations but he also fell off some routine tackles as usual. His selection for me Indicates a half hearted / confused approach to experimentation. Why try things like shoving tuilagi on the wing, whilst reverting to Ashton instead of rewarding the form showed by Anthony Watson?

Haskell and Eastmond: Haskell had been the form England back rower. He was part of our best effort at winning a game in the first test and made an ungodly number of tackles from memory. To my mind, Tom Wood isn't a player of the sort of calibre that he demands Instant reselection. Haskell should have played the second test. Dropping him outright was a mistake and sent the wrong message.

Same with Eastmond. Play him second test unless you believe twelvetrees is such a step up that he demands selection (he's not, and doesnt). The third test Is the time for big changes - that's when you bring back your other guys if your in the hunt for a series consolation.

Re Ben Youngs: I don't really care if he can split defences open, if he still can't sling the ball out with alacrity like Aaron Smith does then I don't want to know.

Great post. I feel Haskell was vey hard done by. I think Lancaster is half forward-thinking, half conservative. He's not very conservative but at times you do wonder whether the likes of Watson and Cipriani would have been more rewarding than some of his picks.
 
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And from a more long-term POV, Moriarty, Stooke and maybe Ludlow and Hill.

There are also a few players already of age at Gloucester, who I can see getting very good under a decent coach. Gareth Evans and Tom Savage in particular.
 
If Laurie Fisher is appointed as head coach at Gloucester, it could be good news for England fans.
As far as I'm aware he's one of the most well respected breakdown coaches around - working with Kvesic (who's already very good in that aspect) and Morgan could be very positive for us.

And a really good article from Flatman, that resonates totally with my opinion of Kyle: http://talksport.com/rugby-union/david-flatman-column-write-kyle-eastmond-your-peril-14062698520

Nought to argue with there save the uncomfortable feeling that Lanfarrell believes otherwise.
 
And a really good article from Flatman, that resonates totally with my opinion of Kyle: http://talksport.com/rugby-union/david-flatman-column-write-kyle-eastmond-your-peril-14062698520

K Eastmond 2 Was targeted early on and horribly exposed. Too small and, after all, is a rugby league player trying to learn the game. It was embarrassing for him to be taken off.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/ru...y-exposed-and-Courtney-Lawes-disappeared.html

The article Flatman was referring to was from Steve James of the telegraph, who awarded Kyle a 2 for that 3rd test performance. Have to admit after re-watching the game again, I can see where Flatman is coming from, it was not as though Kyle was getting run over, time and again. The problem was the gap left between Kyle and Manu was so big and also that Kyle kept getting sucked in by Nonu and Jane's dummy runs, which left Cruden able to exploit that massive gap time and again. It was as much a problem of lack of communication between Eastmond and Manu that was to blame, rather than Easmond's size.

So, yes totally unfair just to pick on his stature as the cause for his 1st half 3test performance; that's just a mark and comment given by a journalist straight after the game, without any proper thought
 

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