Elton Jantjies - Not SA's solution at Fly Half

[TRF_heineken]

I think it's time we talk about Elton Jantjies.

This past weekend's QF match against the Sharks, yet again proved to me that he's not our solution at Fly Half. My reasons are:

1. He buckles under pressure
2. Can't kick at goal outside 30m
3. Can't play with certain scrumhalves
4. Decision making at crucial times are poor
5. His image.

Now let me explain point 5. His image, to me, is not that of a Springbok fly half. He looks like a thug, with a very bad hair day and a very poor attempt at growing a beard.

In all the years of Springbok rugby, our flyhalves all looked neat and tidy in appearance, and that also showed in their gameplay. Look at Pat Lambie, Handre Pollard, Henry Honiball, Jannie De Beer, Morne Steyn, Naas Botha, even Louis Koen. These guys always looked very presentable, and that echoed in their playing too. Neatly cut hair, shaved/trimmed beard was the order of the day.

Now before I get lashed for racial discrimination, please note that this has absolutely nothing to do with the colour of Elton's skin colour, nor about the tattoo's on his body. If that was the case, then I should rant about Francois Hougaard, Burger Odendaal, Roscoe Specman and so many others too...

My gripe is that in the position he's playing, we have a certain standard obtained over the years, and it feels to me like Elton is not up to that standard. On Saturday, I was at a local high school function, and the kids all said that he looks terrible. That's not what a role model should look like...

 

[Big_Grumper]

Is he benefitting from being an OK fly-half in a successful team? The Lions have a good back line and perhaps they make him look better?

I look back at your previous 10s (your list plus Hougaard) and tend to agree. My biggest gripe is his game management: he often appears very one-dimensional.

I like the look of Willemse at Western Province. He's only 18 but he's got something about him.

 

[TRF_heineken]

Is he benefitting from being an OK fly-half in a successful team? The Lions have a good back line and perhaps they make him look better?

I look back at your previous 10s (your list plus Hougaard) and tend to agree. My biggest gripe is his game management: he often appears very one-dimensional.

I like the look of Willemse at Western Province. He's only 18 but he's got something about him.

Well, in the France tests, I can't say if he was that good or if the French were that bad. But it does seem that the team "carries" him if that is the correct wording.

Handre Pollard is now with the Springbok conditioning team, along with Lionel Cronje. And I wonder how long will it be before one of them takes over from him.

Last year during the Irish tour and the Rugby Championship, he was caught out on numerous occasions. but not only that, the camera is on him more than any other player in the team as he kicks at goal, and for touch, so they regularly zoom in on him and his terrible appearance.

 

[Bruce_ma gooshvili]

He is nowhere near his Super Rugby form of last year that is for sure. As I've been saying all year I think he is clearly missing the quick ball of Faf so he is not on the front foot against opposing defences so much any more.

With Faf moving to Europe and not having enough caps to qualify it seems clear Jantjies will have to improve his chemistry with other scrum halves if he is to have any chance of securing the Bok position long term.

I think the Boks have significant issues at halfback having broken the Faf/Jantjies tandem before it even got a proper chance. It is a real shame to me that the only time they have been allowed to play together in a Bok jersey they have clearly been instructed to not play their natural game and instead kick for territory (which made both of them look bad last year).

Jantjies may also regress further once Ackerman leaves the Lions as it sounds like he found his best form with Ackerman.

BUT

The alternatives are not exactly great. Pollard was arguably the worst performing starting flyhalf in South Africa this year (the Bulls seemed much more incisive with Scomen (sic) at 10). I think there are big questionmarks over Pollards ability to play the high tempo running game that the Boks and SA SR clubs have clearly signed up to since their conference / indaba thing. Maybe he improved in the last couple of weeks? The Bulls did seem to start scoring more points so fingers crossed it has just taken him a long time to recover from the injury. Having Serfontain outside him at 12 would help (although I'd pick a fit RJvR at 12).

I have been bigging up Lionel Cronje all season and he should have been blooded in June, but is now away to play in Japan so is presumably ineligible?

Lambie has unfortunate injury issues and is also not exactly ice cool from when I have seen him. I don't think you can commit to him until he shows a bit of physical resilience to show he can be dependable.

Bosch and Willemse are simply too young for RWC 2019 unless all other options are terrible and SA are desperate. They've only just come back from U20 RWC and you can knock a kids development if you elevate them too quickly.

Elton did okayish in June and sadly for the Boks I think okayish is the best they can hope for at flyhalf (and scrum half) regardless of who they play. So I'd definitely give him the jersey in the Rugby Championship but be open to experimenting with different half back combinations in any dead rubbers in that tournament.

Eltons kicking percentage is comparable with the other options, he just had a terrible day at the office against the Sharks (he wasn't the only Lion to do so). The Lions play high risk rugby and that can make you look like a fool when things go wrong.

As for the hair issue, I can't agree with it in general, or about singling out flyhalves or even specifically about Jantjies (who I think is aiming for a well groomed haircut even if I think it is pretty poor - it's not like he is looking like a tramp and daft wee beards are all the rage internationally). Jantjies' attitude on the park is good and he is more of a teddybear than a thug. To be honest a streak of thuggishness would do him the world of good.

 

[pagliaccio_euforico]

I think it's time we talk about Elton Jantjies.

This past weekend's QF match against the Sharks, yet again proved to me that he's not our solution at Fly Half. My reasons are:

1. He buckles under pressure
2. Can't kick at goal outside 30m
3. Can't play with certain scrumhalves
4. Decision making at crucial times are poor
5. His image.

Now let me explain point 5. His image, to me, is not that of a Springbok fly half. He looks like a thug, with a very bad hair day and a very poor attempt at growing a beard.

In all the years of Springbok rugby, our flyhalves all looked neat and tidy in appearance, and that also showed in their gameplay. Look at Pat Lambie, Handre Pollard, Henry Honiball, Jannie De Beer, Morne Steyn, Naas Botha, even Louis Koen. These guys always looked very presentable, and that echoed in their playing too. Neatly cut hair, shaved/trimmed beard was the order of the day.

Now before I get lashed for racial discrimination, please note that this has absolutely nothing to do with the colour of Elton's skin colour, nor about the tattoo's on his body. If that was the case, then I should rant about Francois Hougaard, Burger Odendaal, Roscoe Specman and so many others too...

My gripe is that in the position he's playing, we have a certain standard obtained over the years, and it feels to me like Elton is not up to that standard. On Saturday, I was at a local high school function, and the kids all said that he looks terrible. That's not what a role model should look like...

Dog whistle

 

[TRF_heineken]

He is nowhere near his Super Rugby form of last year that is for sure. As I've been saying all year I think he is clearly missing the quick ball of Faf so he is not on the front foot against opposing defences so much any more.

With Faf moving to Europe and not having enough caps to qualify it seems clear Jantjies will have to improve his chemistry with other scrum halves if he is to have any chance of securing the Bok position long term.

I think the Boks have significant issues at halfback having broken the Faf/Jantjies tandem before it even got a proper chance. It is a real shame to me that the only time they have been allowed to play together in a Bok jersey they have clearly been instructed to not play their natural game and instead kick for territory (which made both of them look bad last year).

Jantjies may also regress further once Ackerman leaves the Lions as it sounds like he found his best form with Ackerman.

BUT

The alternatives are not exactly great. Pollard was arguably the worst performing starting flyhalf in South Africa this year (the Bulls seemed much more incisive with Scomen (sic) at 10). I think there are big questionmarks over Pollards ability to play the high tempo running game that the Boks and SA SR clubs have clearly signed up to since their conference / indaba thing. Maybe he improved in the last couple of weeks? The Bulls did seem to start scoring more points so fingers crossed it has just taken him a long time to recover from the injury. Having Serfontain outside him at 12 would help (although I'd pick a fit RJvR at 12).

I have been bigging up Lionel Cronje all season and he should have been blooded in June, but is now away to play in Japan so is presumably ineligible?

Lambie has unfortunate injury issues and is also not exactly ice cool from when I have seen him. I don't think you can commit to him until he shows a bit of physical resilience to show he can be dependable.

Bosch and Willemse are simply too young for RWC 2019 unless all other options are terrible and SA are desperate. They've only just come back from U20 RWC and you can knock a kids development if you elevate them too quickly.

Elton did okayish in June and sadly for the Boks I think okayish is the best they can hope for at flyhalf (and scrum half) regardless of who they play. So I'd definitely give him the jersey in the Rugby Championship but be open to experimenting with different half back combinations in any dead rubbers in that tournament.

Eltons kicking percentage is comparable with the other options, he just had a terrible day at the office against the Sharks (he wasn't the only Lion to do so). The Lions play high risk rugby and that can make you look like a fool when things go wrong.

As for the hair issue, I can't agree with it in general, or about singling out flyhalves or even specifically about Jantjies (who I think is aiming for a well groomed haircut even if I think it is pretty poor - it's not like he is looking like a tramp and daft wee beards are all the rage internationally). Jantjies' attitude on the park is good and he is more of a teddybear than a thug. To be honest a streak of thuggishness would do him the world of good.

Yes, Pollard had a torrid start, and was nowhere near the player he was before his injury. But with that said, we can all agree that the Bulls rushed him back too quickly, and in the end it didn't pay off. But with that said, the last game he played before getting injured again, he was looking like his old self, and I think this time, they managed him better, in so far as getting his conditioning up to Bok standard. He is IMHO the best we have.

As for Elton & Faf, I'm not going to get into that discussion, as we all know by now that Faf is your lovechild and that whatever we say on this matter falls on deaf ears...

Lionel Cronje has certainly been performing well this year, And I'm keen to see if we will be one of those late bloomers in this position. He has been a journeyman for a while now. He has been with the Stormers, Bulls, Sharks and now with the Kings, yet this is the first time he's been a standout performer. So the question is if it's just him, or the style of rugby they play, and if he will continue to perform in a Bok jersey.

Our other options are still very young yes, but even them look the part more than Elton.

 

[Icemn]

I think it's time we talk about Elton Jantjies.

This past weekend's QF match against the Sharks, yet again proved to me that he's not our solution at Fly Half. My reasons are:

5.His image.

Now let me explain point 5. His image, to me, is not that of a Springbok fly half. He looks like a thug, with a very bad hair day and a very poor attempt at growing a beard.

dafuq did i just read...

Rugby is nie skoonheidskompetisie nie...

vraag, as Elton gespeel het soos Dan Carter, sou sy voorkoms n probleem gewees het?

Dit lyk vir my soos n lys verskonings hierdie...

p.s Ek sal vir elton n bietjie Buffelsfontein Baard Olie stuur... probleem opgelos...

Elton, geniet jouself jou rowwe bliksem...

 

[Big_Grumper]

Does the forum have an Afrikaans translation thingy? I'd love to know what that last post said.

 

[Bruce_ma gooshvili]

It said.

"Rugby is not a beauty contest ...

Ask if Elton played like Dan Carter, would his appearance have been a problem?

It seems to me like a list of excuses this ...

P.s I will send Elton a little Buffelsfontein Beard Oil ... problem solved ...

Elton, enjoy your rough lightning"

 

[Big_Grumper]

Thanks to the power of Google......

Hy is nie Dan Carter nie!

 

[Ospervat]

Rugby is nie skoonheidskompetisie nie...
Rugby isn't a cleanliness competition.

vraag, as Elton gespeel het soos Dan Carter, sou sy voorkoms n probleem gewees het?
Question, if Elton played like Dan Carter would his appearance be a problem

Dit lyk vir my soos n lys verskonings hierdie...
This looks to me like a list of excuses

p.s Ek sal vir elton n bietjie Buffelsfontein Baard Olie stuur... probleem opgelos...
I'll send Elton a bit of Buffelsfontein Beard Oil - problem solved.

Elton, geniet jouself jou rowwe bliksem...
Enjoy yourself Elton you rough bliksem
Bliksem can have numerous interpretations & connotations but in this instance its kind of a term of endearment implying a naughty boy.

 

[smartcooky]

Most really good 10's look good/great when the team is going forward, yet are still composed when under pressure and/or going backwards.

Jantjes gets the first part right, but folds in the second part. See last year's final, where the Hurricanes simply shut him down

 

[The Jones Boy]

He's 27 in a week.
He should be in his prime but I get the feeling he is still on the learning curve. Maybe in a couple of years he will be the complete package.

 

[TRF_heineken]

Most really good 10's look good/great when the team is going forward, yet are still composed when under pressure and/or going backwards.

Jantjes gets the first part right, but folds in the second part. See last year's final, where the Hurricanes simply shut him down

He's 27 in a week.
He should be in his prime but I get the feeling he is still on the learning curve. Maybe in a couple of years he will be the complete package.

This!

He's supposed to be head and shoulders above the others, but to me, he's just a filler for the others. Handre Pollard, Curwin Bosch, Damian Willemse and Niel Marais are all under 24, and are already showing they have more BMT than Elton.

As for his appearance, I knew that this would bring out negativity from other posters, and I understand that, It's my opinion, and I know others might feel the same.

 

[Cruz_del_Sur]

It's not just that. He lacks heart. The sharks first try last weekend is a good example. He loses the ball and then jogs back as if he was doing some light stretching on a sunny sunday morning about to meet his yoga friends for a latte and some blueberry muffins. It's as if he literally didn't give a flying turd about losing the ball. I like to see the desperation, both in attitude and body language, of a guy who knows he made a mistake and is desperately trying to fix it. Doesn't matter if he fails, i just want him to care. He clearly doesn't.

As for his appearance, I knew that this would bring out negativity from other posters, and I understand that, It's my opinion, and I know others might feel the same.

That's an elegant way to shift the blame. Maybe, just maybe, it's not other posters being negative but just them reacting (quite naturally) to your negativity.
And saying "i know other might feel the same way" is quite a poor excuse.

I'm sure there are other sports that could accommodate your aesthetic needs. Gymnastics and figure skating come to mind. Not a single hair out of place in those.

 

[TRF_heineken]

It's not just that. He lacks heart. The sharks first try last weekend is a good example. He loses the ball and then jogs back as if he was doing some light stretching on a sunny sunday morning about to meet his yoga friends for a latte and some blueberry muffins. It's as if he literally didn't give a flying turd about losing the ball. I like to see the desperation, both in attitude and body language, of a guy who knows he made a mistake and is desperately trying to fix it. Doesn't matter if he fails, i just want him to care. He clearly doesn't.

Not just that, his attitude after the final whistle was also something that didn't sit well with me. He didn't seem bothered that they nearly lost, because of his poor kicking at goal, there wasn't any sign that he was relieved about the result.

That's an elegant way to shift the blame. Maybe, just maybe, it's not other posters being negative but just them reacting (quite naturally) to your negativity.
And saying "i know other might feel the same way" is quite a poor excuse.

I'm sure there are other sports that could accommodate your aesthetic needs. Gymnastics and figure skating come to mind. Not a single hair out of place in those.

I'm not blameshifting. I stated my case, based on what I said originally and what I experienced over the weekend when schoolkids also had the same response as I do regarding his appearance.

Perhaps it's different for us saffas, who are mostly brought up rather conservatively? It's just something that is making it less enjoyable to watch when the Bokke play and you have to look at him most of the time...

 

[Da Grappla]

Appearance says a lot about people

 

[The Jones Boy]

I think it's hard to go passed Handre Pollard.
If that kid can have an injury free run he is going to be as dangerous asd Owen Farrell.

 

[Big_Grumper]

What injury problems has Pollard suffered?

 

[TRF_heineken]

What injury problems has Pollard suffered?

Well he had that big shoulder injury, and was out for nearly 18 months, as he nearly lost his arm due to the surgery procedure which made the shoulder infected.

Then he came back, played 4 games, and then injured his ankle. He had to get surgery for that too, but they had to implant "anchors" into his ankle, to assist the recovery. He had those "anchors" removed last week, and now he just has to recover. Doctors say he will be fit and ready by the second week of the Rugby Championships. But I think they will give him a run only in the 3rd week. Maybe have him run out for the Blue Bulls first to get match fit.