Will Lancaster mix it up for Italy?

[B10]

Seeing as a match thread is a week or so away I thought I would start this thread to gauge opinions on the team to face Italy.

I'm sure we'll see some changes but I'm just not sure how many. It is a great chance to give some players a chance and rest a few bodies as the Wales game is just 6 days later.

I would like to see a team like this:

1. Mako V (Put pressure on Marler and push for a start v Wales)
2. Hartley (Another chance against a experienced Italian front row but at the moment Youngs is my favourite for the Wales game)
3. Cole
4. Lawes (Give him a chance to get his confidence back in his best postion, Launchbury gets to rest up for Wales)
5. Parling
6. Wood
7. Robshaw
8. Morgan/Billy V

9. Care (Keep Youngs on his toes and we shouldn't need Youngs box kicks so often v Italy)
10. Farrell (Get his confidence back after a dodgy performance v France)
11. Foden/Monye
12. Twelvetrees (Let's see how 36-Manu gets on but I fully expect a Barritt recall v Wales no matter what 36 does)
13. Manu
14. Ashton (Losing patience but don't see Lancaster dropping him yet)
15. Brown (Let's see him in his preferred postion for England)

Subs
Tom Youngs
Marler
Wilson
Launchbury
Morgan/Billy V/Haskell
Ben Youngs
Flood/Burns
Goode

It's partly what I want to see, mixed in with what personel I think Lancaster will use in this 6N. I know there are lots of shouts for Wade/May/Varndell but I can't see Lancaster using them this 6N. Some of them will get a chance in Argentina. I reckon the only new faces in the squad will see are Foden or Monye with Billy Vunipola getting a chance if his ankle injury has cleared up.

 

[Peat]

Personally, I hope not. I would like to see continuity and all systems given a run through with Wales and the Grand Slam in mind. Experiment in the summer. Any change mind should be one we would keep for Wales.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

I don't think he will, and don't think he should. Like Peat said, experiment in the summer (we'll have to to an extent due to the Lions and, probably, losing X number of players to that).
Bring Youngs and Haskell (or Morgan, if fit) back in to the side and keep the rest the same.
There's a case for Care starting, too, though Youngs and Farrell are working well together.

 

[j'nuh]

I think too much is made of continuity. Do like any club team in any league in the world does: keep the same backbone to the team and swap a small number of underperforming players. Vunipola and Monye to come in, Brown to fullback. Lawes back to the bench and Haskell/Waldrom in if Morgan isn't fit. If Strettle is in the EPS, then he's in for Ashton.

 

[Peat]

I would actually walk up to a player and hit them in the knee with a hammer to get an injury replacement for Ashton if needed. He's really doing my nut in at the moment. But that, of course, is a change I'd make for Wales as well.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

I think Ashton definitely needs to go. He's too secure in his position and isn't putting in performances worthy of being on the team. His tackling is just dire and he isn't good enough attacking to make up for it. I also think Care deserves a start, he gives faster ball than Youngs and I think that is the style we need. He's got over what I dubbed "Danny Care syndrome" which was just sitting at the back of the ruck with your hands either side of the ball for ages. I think it was largely because of him that the whole use it thing got introduced. He is much much faster now and that's what England need. Brown is one of our better runners and one of the few people that is able to beat defenders (I don't count Tuilagi as beating defenders, he just muscles through most of the time.) Brown really needs to be used properly, his abilities are going to waste. I guess having Tuilagi inside him doesn't help as the ball seems to not go beyond him.

 

[McTallshort]

Mako should start at loosehead as Marler isnt good enough.
Lawes should be dropped
Youngs needs to start at Hooker and Care at scrum half.
Dont know what to do regards Ashton, I dont like him much and he tackles like a mincer but who else is there?

 

[B10]

Stuart Lancaster:

"We can always move Manu Tuilagi to the wing, and bring Billy in at centre.

"It's something we've been looking at and mulling over for a while, trying Manu on the wing.

"And Billy's abilities, form and temperament are something we can utilise as well.

"Brad and Manu work extremely well together, but we do want to look at different combinations and try different things.

"We might have a chance to do that in the next game."

Woodward's gone a bit extreme with his team selection in his DM column, whole new backline! :lol:

​

 

[Teh Mite]

I know Hartley hardly set the world alight against France, but I think people are forgetting just how bad Youngs has been so far. I'd drop him completely and put Webber on the bench.

 

[Patchey]

Woodward's gone a bit extreme with his team selection in his DM column, whole new backline! :lol:
View attachment 2083

​

I would genuinely love to see this.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

I know Hartley hardly set the world alight against France, but I think people are forgetting just how bad Youngs has been so far. I'd drop him completely and put Webber on the bench.

Not very?
I hate Youngs with a passion, but he's done nothing wrong since playing for England, as much as it pains me to say.
His throwing ain't amazing, but its better than I expected, and his work in the loose/at the breakdown is 2nd to none (/no other English Hookers, anyhow).

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[Teh Mite]

His lineout's been **** (which we've established is a deeper running problem), but he's been crap in the scrum and he's got feet for hands in the loose play.

Granted he did well in 1 match in December. That however was a long time ago.

 

[Peat]

Can't agree with any of that save the lineout bit. I'd revert to Youngs for Italy.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Our scrum looked better with him on than Hartley, though, I thought :huh:
Don't agree on him having poor hands. His lineout throwing was as good as Hartley's was yesterday, and his work in the loose is far higher than Hartley's yesterday. I can't see a case for keeping Hartley at 2 over Youngs.

 

[ratsapprentice]

Can't agree with any of that save the lineout bit. I'd revert to Youngs for Italy.

Our scrum looked better with him on than Hartley, though, I thought :huh:
Don't agree on him having poor hands. His lineout throwing was as good as Hartley's was yesterday, and his work in the loose is far higher than Hartley's yesterday. I can't see a case for keeping Hartley at 2 over Youngs.

Youngs is so far ahead of Hartley in ball carrying and breakdown ability that I can't accept any argument for him not being first choice.

I can't be bothered to check exactly how the EPS/Saxons system works, so can anyone tell me who is actually available for Lancaster to select?

 

[TRF_Olyy]

EPS: Tom Youngs, Dylan Hartley
Saxons: Joe Gray, Rob Buchanan

Don't think Gray or Buchanan would be a step up from Hartley/Youngs.
Forgot about Webber, he was out injured for so long. I was a big fan of his at Wasps.

 

[Patchey]

Just seen a news story about Lancaster saying that Chris Ashton's form is concerning him and he may get dropped for Italy...

Proof of some form of deity with an interest in rugby?

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Just seen a news story about Lancaster saying that Chris Ashton's form is concerning him and he may get dropped for Italy...

Proof of some form of deity with an interest in rugby?

Presumably Tuilagi to the wing with 36 in the centres, as mentioned before.
I think it could work, however if I was going to play a centre on the wing then Joseph would be my first choice.

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[ratsapprentice]

EPS: Tom Youngs, Dylan Hartley
Saxons: Joe Gray, Rob Buchanan

Don't think Gray or Buchanan would be a step up from Hartley/Youngs.
Forgot about Webber, he was out injured for so long. I was a big fan of his at Wasps.

I was talking about the squad as a whole, not hooker specifically. I personally think Youngs is streets ahead of everyone else at the moment.
The wingers were who I was thinking about...

I would be happy to see Tuilagi on the wing, can't see it being a long term thing though. Especially as Leicester will NEVER play him there.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Mixing EPS and Saxons together (at the start of the Six Nations, anyway - so this is with players called up to replace others, e.g. Brookes is here instead of Henry Thomas, but Thomas is back now)

Hooker: Youngs, Hartley, Buchanan, Gray
Prop: Cole, Corbisiero, Marler, Vunipola, Wilson, Brookes, Doran-Jones, Knight, Mullan, Wood
Lock: Launchbury, Lawes, Parling, Botha, Slater, Kitchener, Robson, Slater
Backrow: Clark, Croft, Haskell, Johnson, Robshaw, Wood, Morgan, Waldrom, Dowson, Fraser, Gibson, Kruis, Crane
Scrumhalf: Care, Dickson, Youngs, Simpson, Wigglesworth
Flyhalf: Burns, Farrell, Flood, Ford
Centre: Barritt, Joseph, Tuilagi, Twelvetrees, Allen, Daly, Lowe, Tomkins, Turner-Hall
Back three: Ashton, Foden, Strettle, Brown, Goode, Biggs, Eastmond, Monye, Sharples, Wade, Abendanon, May