[2016 RBS Six Nations] Round 4: England vs. Wales (12/03/2016)

[psychic duck]

Since when was 'gypsy' a race? Honestly, I look at Samson Lee and just see a slightly round man with Celtic heritage. I would never have known he was a gypsy if it hadn't been pointed out before.

 

[ncurd]

Since when was 'gypsy' a race? Honestly, I look at Samson Lee and just see a slightly round man with Celtic heritage. I would never have known he was a gypsy if it hadn't been pointed out before.

Covered several times already it's ethnic group not a racial one. Same rules apply.

 

[j'nuh]

If hearing Marler calling Lee a Gypsy boy makes people watching think they are ok to racially abuse people then I would say the collective opinion of the rugby watching community is we are all mindless idiots with no clue about right or wrong

It's about setting clearer boundaries on what is and isn't acceptable. Whereas society has (generally) come to a collective view on eugenics, segregation and so on (the most overt forms of racism), there is still confusion on various racial topics. There isn't a particular public consensus on positive discrimination, racist jokes/banter, "ironic racism" etc. I think a lot of people think that Marler's comments were acceptable; it's a good chance for public discourse over the matter. I don't think Marler should be crucified, I reckon his joke was more ignorant than wilfully spiteful towards gypsy communities, but he should definitely publicly apologise to gypsy communities.

Also, although I don't think anyone will consciously make a decision to be racist in reaction to this, I think that if we don't call these types of actions out, then we normalise the behaviour. Words that used to be in the public vernacular have fallen out of it because of a concerted effort to call out perpetrators; I think the same has to happen in this case.

Since when was 'gypsy' a race? Honestly, I look at Samson Lee and just see a slightly round man with Celtic heritage. I would never have known he was a gypsy if it hadn't been pointed out before.

https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/d...s/gypsies-and-travellers-race-discrimination/

 

[TW27BA]

Joe Marler avoids sanction for "gypsy boy" comment.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/35827133

 

[TobesHodges]

Of course he did, I dread to think how much chat they give in those scrums.. Just a bit of banter heard on the ref mic..

 

[Ospreylian]

We all need to remember that Marler is immune to any form of punishment from the governing bodies because all the refs adore his "banter". Oh how they chortle in rapturous glee.



Marler is king of banter. He's so good I reckon he could banterbate whilst riding a bantelope all the way to Banterbury to take part in a bantathlon, all in time to catch the last banter bus all the way down to Bantarctica.

#lad #BanterseaPowerStation #BantasaurusRex #banti-matter

 

[Lé Ddanno]

You cheeky Nandos

 

[jackass11]

Another good decision, well done, lets not turn rugby into a sport that doesnt live on the edge, i dont agree personally with the reference, the fact he used boy and not a swear word i think is key.

Cant believe there have been pages of arguments over it and very few posts on deliberate eye gouging which is something that needs to be stamped out of the game immediately!

 

[Thingimubob]

Since when was 'gypsy' a race? Honestly, I look at Samson Lee and just see a slightly round man with Celtic heritage. I would never have known he was a gypsy if it hadn't been pointed out before.

Yupp they are a race. Protected under the Equality act:

https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/d...s/gypsies-and-travellers-race-discrimination/

Actually disgusted that he's got away with both.

Essentially, if you're English and "sorry" later on you can do whatever you want on the pitch. Utter joke.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

But he's not Romany or Irish?
I've had a google around and it just says he's from gypsy stock, no that he's Romany or Irish Traveller.


I grew up in the country and we had gypsies through our village maybe 2 or 3 times a year. There's a big difference between Romany Gypsies, Irish Travellers and the gypsy camps we had set up on the farm land round here.

 

[jackass11]

If he had said valley boy would you have been offended?

I live in ireland and far worse has been said to me in amatuer footy, you just need to grow up and get over it

its a joke your getting upset

 

[Peat]

Another beautiful example of how well run this game is.

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

The report says that his apology was unprompted. I think that's a big factor.

It was a daft thing done in the heat of the moment (at least I assume it was; if it was planned I'd drop him for seriously sub standard sledging). He quickly realised he'd got it wrong and said sorry of his own accord. Lee and the WRU aren't making a thing out of it and well done to them for keeping things in proportion.

Right conclusion I think. Even though there's no formal sanction it's a mistake he won't be making again in a hurry. His name has been muddied and lessons will have been learned.

 

[Thingimubob]

If he had said valley boy would you have been offended?

I live in ireland and far worse has been said to me in amatuer footy, you just need to grow up and get over it

its a joke your getting upset

Plenty grown up thank you.

The cheap shot annoys me as that's at least a week ban normally.

Valleys aren't a race last I checked. So because worse is said elsewhere, we should condone it here? Simple fact is the sport should be holding itself to a higher standard.

 

[jackass11]

Rugby doesnt does it though - If you expect any sportsmen to live to higher standards then you shouldn't watch sport

The only racism they will clamp down on is if you directly critisie the colour of the skin, and thats because there was a societal discrimination for along time

nb valley boy was just an example, could quite easily have used posh boy for the english

 

[Thingimubob]

Gypsy is his race as far as I understand (what he had identified as in the past) I see it as no different to pointing out someone's skin colour.

 

[jackass11]

if i called you welsh boy then?

My point was if i called you a welsh xxxx that would make a big difference

He's not upset so why are you?

- - - Updated - - -

Skin colour is always different, in most places in the world now, due to the dreadful discrimination that is well documented

 

[Thingimubob]

if i called you welsh boy then?

My point was if i called you a welsh xxxx that would make a big difference

He's not upset so why are you?

- - - Updated - - -

Skin colour is always different, in most places in the world now, due to the dreadful discrimination that is well documented

Welsh is not a protected race, it's a nationality. Big difference.

I'm annoyed because he's targeted a player by his race to get a reaction. That is wrong, Marler (I'm hoping) knows it's wrong, hence the apology, Jones knows it's wrong, Howled knows it's wrong, Gatland eventually ceded that it was wrong. Even if Lee isn't offended by it, it's still a wrong thing to do as it sets a horrible example, and there is simply no place in the game to bring any sort of racial terms in, "banter" or not.

Discrimination against gypsies is fairly well documented too. In particular, they were one of the races targeted by the Nazi's during the holocaust. Why is that different than the atrocities committed against races of other skin colours?

That horrible stain on history shows us that racism goes far beyond just skin colour.

 

[g6mcg]

Essentially, if you're English and "sorry" later on you can do whatever you want on the pitch. Utter joke.

I don't think England get the rub much more than any other tier 1 nation. System far too inconsistent to spot patterns anyway!

Agree that both incidents deserved bans, but I have no expectation of the citing process working.

 

[jackass11]

I agree, its does set a horrible example, but sport is not ready to be the moral guardian of society, thats up to the government and the courts and the people who enforce societies rules

if i called someone from that community the same thing in front of a policeman then most likley nothing would happen to me, if i commented on the colour of the skin id probably get arrested, thats just a fact of life, i am not saying you shouldnt be upset, it just needs to contextualised with the general feeling with the wider community

I have a much bigger problem with someone trying to stick fingers in someones eyes, or trying to bite people on a sports ground etc lets tackle those first