Ireland v South Africa

[munstermuffin]

I expect a few will be rested up for All Blacks game and these will cover.

 

[Peat]

I'm pleased for Henry who's been playing well, but slightly mystified at his inclusion. Not sure what McFadden's done to deserve inclusion either, but I guess if Kidney wants an extra centre he's the next best option... other than a lot of the wingers already in his squad.

 

[munstermuffin]

McFadden is surely behind Earls, BOD, D'Arcy, Wallace, Murphy, and possibly Bowe in the centre and while he is stuck on the bench at Leinster he can't truly be considered. And the younger guys coming through now seem to be keeping him out also.

 

[Peat]

Yup. Also, if Cave was fit, I'd have him ahead, he's been in better form.

And add Fitzgerald to that list pending on form.

 

[snoopy snoopy dog dog]

Kidney seems to have a hard on for a few players- Tony Buckley, Mick O'Driscoll and Gavin Duffy stand out. You can add Fergus McFadden, Chris Henry and Devin Toner to that list of players who probably don't deserve international call ups. I rate O'Driscoll, Earls, Cave and Bowe as significantly better options at 13 to McFadden.

Good to see Mike Ross called up. He's nearly 31 so he'd better grasp this opportunity over the next three weeks for he won't get many more chances. He doesn't have much mileage on the clock so there's a chance he could stick around for maybe 3 more seasons if he grasps this opportunity.

 

[coonor]

I think Kearney is getting better and for Leinster has been doing well. The problem is the lions tour showed us him as a truely great full back, he needs to find that again ecause he has got talent.

 

[SavageLez]

I have to eat my words. I called an Ireland victory. 13 Springbok injuries (5 = key players) and Ireland had home ground advantage!
Well done to the Springboks. I am glad to see that the Sharks won the Currie Cup and the Springboks have beaten Ireland without John smit. Finally SA will realize tha Bismarck du Plessis is way better and that Victor Matfield (MOTM) should captain the side! Well done to Victor and SA on a great victory with all the negative press, coach bullsh... and all the injuries.

 

[King_D'Arcy]

Lez, you must be excited about Scotland-New Zealand this weekend. Knowing you you probably have touchline tickets for Murrayfield. Enjoy!

 

[SavageLez]

With confidence and form, don't be surprised if Scotland fare better than Ireland mate?!

 

[TRF_Cymro]

With confidence and form, don't be surprised if Scotland fare better than Ireland mate?!

Well which one are you asking, are you making a point or asking a question.

Mate seriously if you are gonna start acting like a WUM then jog on!

 

[munstermuffin]

Kidney seems to have a hard on for a few players- Tony Buckley, Mick O'Driscoll and Gavin Duffy stand out. You can add Fergus McFadden, Chris Henry and Devin Toner to that list of players who probably don't deserve international call ups. I rate O'Driscoll, Earls, Cave and Bowe as significantly better options at 13 to McFadden.

Good to see Mike Ross called up. He's nearly 31 so he'd better grasp this opportunity over the next three weeks for he won't get many more chances. He doesn't have much mileage on the clock so there's a chance he could stick around for maybe 3 more seasons if he grasps this opportunity.

Have to agree with this Snoop and well address this easy.
- In centre McFadden struggles to make a Leinster squad even when some Internationals are missing. I'm not saying he is a poor player just he is behind 2 great players and now there are very talented backs such as O'Malley coming through. Also this may be unfair but in past McFadden only got some Leinster caps due to his ability to kick at goal.

-In 2nd row Toner is like Micko (althought Micko is better at this): A fine squad player at provincal level but will never be a decent International. I struggle to see how we continue to overlook Casey as he is possibly a player we badly need.

-In radio today Paul Wallace made an excellent point that Buckley should always be in an Irish 22 but with the #17 shirt as he is probably the best impact prop off bench we have when the opposition tires. Ross deserves a shot but I don't think he is our answer either and well I WON'T BE SURPRISED TO SEE JOHN HAYES VS NZ

 

[coonor]

We need to look at the opposition. For example against top scrummaging teams like South Africa we need to play Ross and Court to keep the scrum stable so we can retain ball but against teams with weaker scrums like Australia we would probably get away with playing Buckley and Healy. I am a strong believer in picking the player that challenges the opposition the most and suits the game plan. That player may not be the better player but the more suitable player. Like O'Gara should be played on rainy days when we want territory and Sexton on days where we want to play with the ball in hand.

 

[Shaggy]

We need to look at the opposition. For example against top scrummaging teams like South Africa we need to play Ross and Court to keep the scrum stable so we can retain ball but against teams with weaker scrums like Australia we would probably get away with playing Buckley and Healy. I am a strong believer in picking the player that challenges the opposition the most and suits the game plan. That player may not be the better player but the more suitable player. Like O'Gara should be played on rainy days when we want territory and Sexton on days where we want to play with the ball in hand.

Sure, there's a strong case for picking your players to suit or counter the side that you are playing each week, but I think from what the games I've seen this season (admittedly they have been mostly SH tests), there has been a real advantage in playing the same players (where possible) from week to week.

 

[profitius]

Have to agree with this Snoop and well address this easy.
- In centre McFadden struggles to make a Leinster squad even when some Internationals are missing. I'm not saying he is a poor player just he is behind 2 great players and now there are very talented backs such as O'Malley coming through. Also this may be unfair but in past McFadden only got some Leinster caps due to his ability to kick at goal.

-In 2nd row Toner is like Micko (althought Micko is better at this): A fine squad player at provincal level but will never be a decent International. I struggle to see how we continue to overlook Casey as he is possibly a player we badly need.

-In radio today Paul Wallace made an excellent point that Buckley should always be in an Irish 22 but with the #17 shirt as he is probably the best impact prop off bench we have when the opposition tires. Ross deserves a shot but I don't think he is our answer either and well I WON'T BE SURPRISED TO SEE JOHN HAYES VS NZ

I reckon Toner is much better than MOD. Toner is 6ft 10 and against Munster he dominated the lineouts. Hes not great in open play but neither is MOD.

Time for DOC and D'Arcy to be dropped too I think. They've been in the team automatically for years have have done little.

 

[munstermuffin]

My point was he like Micko, a great option in a squad and will do a job filling in but he isn't international class and not a realistic option for going forward

 

[Peat]

In fairness, rather doubt McFadden and Henry are in line for starts. They're injury cover and players to provide opposition in training who already know their way around the squad and who may well be involved in the squad in future. I think McFadden's a very good player, and probably should have taken D'Arcy's place at 12 last season while Henry is also a good player who's probably getting a raw deal from position experimentation. But yes, at the moment, there are other better options than both if they are going to play.

MunsterMuffin, Casey is dead on his feet and off the pace at domestic level. Not the best available.

I disagree with you about Toner (who's only 24 or 25), I think he has international potential... I also think Ireland don't have enough locks to not try him at some point. Unless you want Ryan Caldwell calling your lineout.

 

[munstermuffin]

Casey is a solid operator at set pieces and I disagree about Toner ever making it to stage where he will be a consistent lock in Irish team. Ryan is a better 6 so no won't consider him a future lock. The likes of Nagle in Munster and I know there few in Leinster but that is what will be in when Paulie, DOC and Cullen go.
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Will say it here because no thread up but I am massively dissappointed with team to play Samoa. No Keith Earls either I actually am bit dumbstruck that Mike Ross is not been tested. I don't think Toner will be a serious international but deserves a chance. What is point in playing BOD when we need to test ourselves without him in case of injury.

I actually don't know

 

[TRF_stormer2010]

I actually thought Spies had one of his better games. He did lose the ball in a tackle now and then, but always made it past the first defender. Incredible strength he has. When Heaslip did his 'roll-up-roll-up' thing he eventually ran into Spies. Heaslip was driven back like a scrum-half.

Kirchner almost lost the game for us thanks to his mediocrity. Other than that, it was 8 against 7. Our forwards, with Irelands pack nowhere, versus Ireland's backs, with our back-line nowhere.

Some ferocious tackling though.

I suggets you watch that game again: Spies was tackled backwards at laest 3 times. Also, the times he beat defenders he was running laterally and not gaining any yards, only putting us under pressure. As for his defense and handling...

No, there are at least 3 other SA no8s who offer more in just about all departments. Vermaulen ,Kankowski and Alberts.

 

[Peat]

Casey is a solid operator at set pieces and I disagree about Toner ever making it to stage where he will be a consistent lock in Irish team. Ryan is a better 6 so no won't consider him a future lock. The likes of Nagle in Munster and I know there few in Leinster but that is what will be in when Paulie, DOC and Cullen go.
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Will say it here because no thread up but I am massively dissappointed with team to play Samoa. No Keith Earls either I actually am bit dumbstruck that Mike Ross is not been tested. I don't think Toner will be a serious international but deserves a chance. What is point in playing BOD when we need to test ourselves without him in case of injury.

I actually don't know

Start a new thread then...

But I agree with most of what you say there.

 

[TRF_Ezequiel]

I suggets you watch that game again: Spies was tackled backwards at laest 3 times. Also, the times he beat defenders he was running laterally and not gaining any yards, only putting us under pressure. As for his defense and handling...

No, there are at least 3 other SA no8s who offer more in just about all departments. Vermaulen ,Kankowski and Alberts.

Vermeulen is not in the squad and Alberts is not really an 8-man. I prefer him as a flanker. Leaves Kankowski