[RWC2019] Typhoon Hagibis - Discussion Thread

[Cardy]

Does anyone know why they cancelled the games so early? Accuweather says gusts of 110 kph in Toyota . That's not huge , the hurricanes have probably played in that.

MONEY?

 

[Umaga's Witness]

I'm so angry I've had to join this forum to let out some of my frustration. How dare they do this to our game. It is criminal negligence on the part of World Rugby. They knew Japan was prone to typhoons but didn't have a contingency? England have already left for Myazaki, which proves the game could have been played elsewhere. This tournament has been ruined. How can you some teams playing more games than others. Italy definitly and maybe Scotland should consider sueing World Rugby.

On another point. I'm not a fan. I was a player and an active member of my club. I spilt my blood and broke my bones for the love of my club, the game, and if I had been good enough and given tbe opportunity my country(England). I hate being referred to as a fan. It's our game, not the Rugby administrators and greedy commercial interested parties to serve up to us. It's about time we had a Rugby revolution and took our game back.

Rant over.

Cardy

Having a contingency plan would have cost money, so some rich kid would Have got less toys this year, the marginal utility of which is practically zero.
Just like the cricket World Cup

 

[Cardy]

Each and everyone of us knows why we played and love Rugby. We are continually being preached at about Rugby's core values. Where is the respect for Italy. Fours years of somebody's work being taken away from them by a Rugby administrator on a freebie. As they are in the land of the rising son perhaps they could do us all a favour and commit a collective Hari Kari.

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

It's a tainted world cup from now on, put an asterix next to it! Everyone knows it was Italy's to lose.

And if there's one thing Italy do better than anyone else it's lose

 

[TheOvalBall]

Well this puts a dampener on things. Pun intended

Was really looking forward to England vs France.

 

[Jer1cho]

Yeah I have to say this WC has not been remembered for the Rugby so far. Handling errors galore due to humidity... officiating which has put the rules into disripute... More red cards in 3 weeks than we are used to in a calendar year, and now games being flat out cancelled because of typhoons, which could have a massive influence on the entire tournament.

World Rugby have basically become FIFA. Wanting to grow the game so you stage a tournament in Japan in Typhoon season while minnow teams still arrive with amateur players who have part time jobs only for the rest of us to say oh, losing by 60 is better than 100. We all know World Rugby does sweet F all to help these teams out in the 4 years between.

How can a tournament be fair if every team is part of a lottery? No disrespect to Japan as they can't control the weather and have been good hosts, but really, prevention is better than cure and there should have been a better way of doing this than what we have seen.

 

[mdaclarke]

Scotland are on about legal action. If that succeeds then surely all the cancelled games would have to be played

There are also rumour that New Zealand refused to allow a rescheduled game

 

[Yoshimitsu]

As I stated upthread. All rugby is politics. The game means nothing as the indecent scrabble for control continues. The unions and the hemispheres constantly battling for primacy.

It does not matter one iota what is "right". It's about gaining advantage now or for arguments to come. Despite the salty tone of the BBC article there's a grain of truth there. The SRU had the temerity to question the wisdom of destroying the Six Nations at the behest of those that wish to "grow the game". They are therefore a nation non grata. They have no friends at the top table. The precedent set with NZ vs Italy means that if there's any significant issues on Sunday they (Scotland) are screwed. The game will be canned and Scotland will be thrown to the wolves. It's only fair see... consistency.

World Rugby need to tread carefully here. I think they misjudge their audience. Fairness and sportsmanship matter more to the average rugby fan than I suspect they realise. We may be tribal but injustice is not something we'll forgive. The precedent set is that small countries can be dispensed with. As Parisse said. If New Zealand needed 5 points a way would have been found. I have no doubt of this whatever.

It's already a disgrace. If Scotland go it'll be a scandal and World Rugby should reap what they have sown..............

 

[mdaclarke]

As I stated upthread. All rugby is politics. The game means nothing as the indecent scrabble for control continues. The unions and the hemispheres constantly battling for primacy.

It does not matter one iota what is "right". It's about gaining advantage now or for arguments to come. Despite the salty tone of the BBC article there's a grain of truth there. The SRU had the temerity to question the wisdom of destroying the Six Nations at the behest of those that wish to "grow the game". They are therefore a nation non grata. They have no friends at the top table. The precedent set with NZ vs Italy means that if there's any significant issues on Sunday they (Scotland) are screwed. The game will be canned and Scotland will be thrown to the wolves. It's only fair see... consistency.

World Rugby need to tread carefully here. I think they misjudge their audience. Fairness and sportsmanship matter more to the average rugby fan than I suspect they realise. We may be tribal but injustice is not something we'll forgive. The precedent set is that small countries can be dispensed with. As Parisse said. If New Zealand needed 5 points a way would have been found. I have no doubt of this whatever.

It's already a disgrace. If Scotland go it'll be a scandal and World Rugby should reap what they have sown..............

Agreed. the chances of Japan ever hosting a major rugby event again would be out of the window.

 

[Leinster Fan]

Does anyone know why they cancelled the games so early? Accuweather says gusts of 110 kph in Toyota . That's not huge , the hurricanes have probably played in that.

Probably to stop fans putting themselves in danger by travelling to the game, which is fair enough.

 

[Leinster Fan]

But anyway, regardless of anything and regardless of what happens, world rugby are architects of their of downfall here and deserve all the criticism that has and will come their way.

They might not be rampantly corrupt FIFA style, but the clowns at the top barely have a brain cell between them, it's been clear for years with the nations league farce but this has just made it more obvious than ever.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

Eddie Jones saying Scotland only have themselves to blame if they go out due to the game being cancelled... Even by Jones standards that is a full on dick statement. What a prat.

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

https://mobile.twitter.com/brianmoore666/status/1182355309337153537?s=09

He's an annoying man. But he's dead right.

 

[Yoshimitsu]

Eddie Jones saying Scotland only have themselves to blame if they go out due to the game being cancelled... Even by Jones standards that is a full on dick statement. What a prat.

I concur. Though I wonder if his treatment by Scottish "fans" had something to do with the lack of empathy.....

https://www.scotsman.com/news-2-150...sing-england-rugby-boss-eddie-jones-1-4740369

I note that Hansen has taken a similarly dickish line.... Tournament scheduling plays a role in when points can be won..... Blaming the Scots for failing to get enough point from their hardest fixtures is bollicks....

 

[die_mole]

I don't have too much sympathy for Scotland or Italy myself. They played the same amount of games against the same opponents as the team they are losing a spot to.

I would feel really bad for Ireland if their game against Samoa got cancelled but Scotland and japan got to play. Scotland and japan already got their chance to take 5 points from Samoa but Ireland wouldn't have.

 

[Brigantine]

Agreed. the chances of Japan ever hosting a major rugby event again would be out of the window.

Like the 2020 Olympic 7s?

https://mobile.twitter.com/brianmoore666/status/1182355309337153537?s=09

He's an annoying man. But he's dead right.

5. Scotland will argue that the force majeure clause in the agreement allows the rules to be varied by agreement of the participants and World Rugby. I'm told that Japan are embarrassed about the issue and would play later if allowed.

I'd be happy with that resolution actually. Then it's just the All Blacks who are within their rights but still ********s for being inflexible.

The excuse blaming stupid fans for trying to travel to a behind-closed-doors game is rubbish IMO. Way OTT risk aversion and actually disrespectful, as if fans pay '000s and travel half way around the world on a whim for no particular reason of any importance. There's no benefit to outweigh a tiny bit of risk.

One question... everyone is blaming World Rugby for this. Isn't it Japan in charge of organizing it?

OTOH... yes everyone knows when typhoon season is, but it's the tail-end of the season and man what were the chances of a super typhoon passing right over the biggest venue in the middle of the busiest weekend of the tournament!
All of the 5 biggest venues are in the storm warning area. But 3 are not including Oita, which has a roof.

A good point several people have made that this typhoon doesn't only affect Rugby. I have nothing but sympathy for everyone else in the storm's path with no responsibility for RWC organization.

 

[Leinster Fan]

Let's just get real here: in an alternative universe where the All Blacks lost to South Africs and the points fell in such a way that they needed a result here to go through, the Italy game would never have been cancelled. The double standards here are sickening.

As others have said, Brian Moore has hit the nail on the head.

Make no mistake, every rugby player at the tournament and every rugby fan around the world has been let down by the clowns running the sport here and it's going to take a long, long time for rugby to come back from the reputational damage that's been inflicted on the sport this week. That's the sense I'm getting both from looking at international press and talking to casual rugby/sports fans I know. Heads need to roll as a result of this farce.

 

[donmcdazzle]

I'd be happy with that resolution actually. Then it's just the All Blacks who are within their rights but still ********s for being inflexible.

Apparently NZ offered to play the game on Friday so as not to cause a 5-day QF turnaround by playing it on Monday, and RWC said no. That is more RWC than NZ to blame there surely. Can't really blame NZ for impacting their QF prep when they had nothing riding on the game being played or not.

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

I don't have too much sympathy for Scotland or Italy myself. They played the same amount of games against the same opponents as the team they are losing a spot to.

I would feel really bad for Ireland if their game against Samoa got cancelled but Scotland and japan got to play. Scotland and japan already got their chance to take 5 points from Samoa but Ireland wouldn't have.

That's like saying X beat Y, Y beat Z so X is better than Z though, it's silly when analysing your average test match, it's mental when assessing a pool where each team expects to play each other and have different timetables. Easy example is that Scotland had to play a fresh Ireland with Conan and Sexton, Japan got Ireland off the back of a short turnaround without those guys, that's not the same opposition.

To be honest I'll feel hard done by as an Ireland fan if Japan get the free draw. Ireland, mistakenly, put almost all of their pool preparation on Scotland and won that game 5-0 as a result, Japan may have done the same to Ireland and could only beat them 4-1, if Japan can't get two points out of Scotland they don't deserve to top the pool and get the easier QF and final run. Equally had Japan failed to get a BP last week I wouldn't feel right at all taking top spot with them not having the chance to play Scotland.

To be honest I think the tournament is ****** from a perspective of fairness just through the games that are already cancelled. Equity isn't really good enough when it comes to matches going ahead or not in this tournament, or any pro tournament, things need to be equal.

 

[die_mole]

That's like saying X beat Y, Y beat Z so X is better than Z though, it's silly when analysing your average test match, it's mental when assessing a pool where each team expects to play each other and have different timetables. Easy example is that Scotland had to play a fresh Ireland with Conan and Sexton, Japan got Ireland off the back of a short turnaround without those guys, that's not the same opposition.

To be honest I'll feel hard done by as an Ireland fan if Japan get the free draw. Ireland, mistakenly, put almost all of their pool preparation on Scotland and won that game 5-0 as a result, Japan may have done the same to Ireland and could only beat them 4-1, if Japan can't get two points out of Scotland they don't deserve to top the pool and get the easier QF and final run. Equally had Japan failed to get a BP last week I wouldn't feel right at all taking top spot with them not having the chance to play Scotland.

To be honest I think the tournament is ****** from a perspective of fairness just through the games that are already cancelled. Equity isn't really good enough when it comes to matches going ahead or not in this tournament, or any pro tournament, things need to be equal.

it's not a great system but I think it's a fair result. You play the same exact schedule and the team who did better over those three games is the team that advances. It's not saying that Japan is better than Scotland, it's saying that Japan had performed better in the pool stage than Scotland, which is undeniably true.

Your gripes about Japan having an easier three games than Ireland since they got an automatic draw against Scotland are valid in my opinion.