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Cheetahs and Kings to join "Pro 14"

profitius said:
Theres only one SA, thats the problem. The same crowd runs the whole country and if some parts have turned into that state, why do you think it won't happen in other areas? Its inevitable.
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Tough question. It also just about implies asking why do we stay..

First, why might it not happen in other areas? Its a compound answer;

Its the nature of those attacks. Its just not blatant enough to say that we are going to have country wide genocide any time soon. Its the size of the country and the fact that the different areas are indeed totally different and people's attitudes are totally different. Its the fact we have black people standing up against the ANC. Its the fact the ANC is losing ground election to election.
Here I have to say there is a concern that its not only to the more generalized DP but also the radical EFF. We'll have to see how this develops but my feeling is positive based on the 'feel on the street' and the fact that the trend is more black people urbanizing, getting better educated and seeing the ANC for what it is. The only way the ANC stays in power is by keeping the black majority ignorant which in itself will defeat them because then they fail their supporters. Thats whats been going on for 21 years now. Its gonna go one way or the other sooner rather than later. My hope is we are too well developed, diverse and our infrastructure too well spread and power structure too spread for us to fall over night.

Which brings me to why we stay on. Which is that we have hope first and foremost and secondly we love this country and would feel like foreigners in other places even if we were welcome. There are a lot of opportunities in SA as a developing country. We have beautiful friendly peoples, living well is cheap (even if travel and luxuries aren't) compared to more developed countries, the weather is beautiful, the countryside is beautiful. Our identity is here. There's just too much to lose for me at least. Don't get me wrong. I have an 'exit strategy' but do not feel threatened enough to execute while I really do feel there is hope.
 
TRF_heineken said:
No it's not inevitable. And you need to live here to understand. There is a massive difference between the urban areas and the rural areas. And while the farm murders, particularly in the Free State area is happening, it's less apparent in other provinces closer to urban areas.

First of education plays a major factor. People in the urban areas are more educated and knows what is going on in the country, and what needs to change. Why else would the ANC lose 4 of the biggest Metropolitan areas to the DA?? People of all races are standing together to fight corruption.

Most of these farm murders are politically motivated, where the majority party spew racist chants in a violent matter, and these rural guys gets paid a boatload of money, to do these heinous act, to try and get the farmers to sell their farm to the government at a cheap value.

It happened here in Limpopo, One of my father's close friends was the owner of the biggest tobacco farm in Limpopo, and then he and his wife was attacked on his farm, had several break-ins etc. to the point that they just said, enough. They had to sell their farm to the Government, and the government GAVE the farm back to the people who had ancestral heritage connected to the land. 3 years later, that land was a barren wasteland with no sign whatsoever that there was ever a multimillion industry operating there. The government then went back to the farmer and asked if he would like to buy the farm back from them. To which he declined, and so the government had to spend a lot of money into training the people living on the farm to actually farm. To this date that farm hasn't performed at all, but what it did do, was stop the government from doing it to other farmers in the Province.

But that's how our majority party does things. First do it their way (which is the wrong way), fail miserably (everytime), and then ask the white man to help them...
Wash, Rinse, Repeat
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Funnily enough, my uncle said something similar, white farmers selling land the to the government and then buying it back a few years later at a discounted price. Apparently it happens quite a lot, but I'm sure you know more about it than me.
 
Looking from the outside my opinion is that large chunks of the ANC itself are perfectly reasonable. As long as Zuma's ex-wife fails to succeed him as leader in the next year there is a real chance of a more moderate, less corrupt leadership within the party. I'll be keeping my fingers crossed for a restoration of sanity.
 
mdaclarke said:
Funnily enough, my uncle said something similar, white farmers selling land the to the government and then buying it back a few years later at a discounted price. Apparently it happens quite a lot, but I'm sure you know more about it than me.
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Well I'm at the Deeds office now on a daily basis, and our firm does a lot of work for the banks with regards to mortgage bonds. And I can tell you that in Limpopo Province, the farmers buying back from the government are much more than the government buying from the farmers. I think the ratio is currently 5 farms being bought back to the 1 farm being bought by the government.

But the real issue is the damage that it causes to our agricultural system, and the time it takes to rehabilitate the farm after it was destroyed.

Bruce_ma_goose said:
Looking from the outside my opinion is that large chunks of the ANC itself are perfectly reasonable. As long as Zuma's ex-wife fails to succeed him as leader in the next year there is a real chance of a more moderate, less corrupt leadership within the party. I'll be keeping my fingers crossed for a restoration of sanity.
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Oh I'm very confident that Zuma's wife won't succeed him. Which is a good thing yes, but the question is who would be the successor? at the moment I think it's a race between Cyril Ramaphosa (our Deputy President), and Baleka Mbete (Speaker of the Parliament). I personally like Cyril, he's a businessman before he was a politician, he knows what our country needs to grow. My biggest issue with him, is his delay tactics, and how he has in the past been a bit racist towards the Afrikaners, not that is any different for any other big name ANC Member.

I would have liked Pravin Gordan or Trevor Manuel to also lift their hand and make themselves available for nomination. But that won't happen.


But we are digressing from the topic at hand. Should we perhaps make another thread regarding South African Politics??
 
TRF_stormer2010 said:
I would be surprised if the numbers traveling would be substantial. The weak Rand is hitting us hard over here. Doubly so when looking at traveling. I suspect their supporters pitching to games will be mostly expats or youngsters working abroad or people traveling anyway (many SA parents take teh opportunity of their children working abroad to travel to those destinations). All in all we aren't big travelers. The Rand is not strong.
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Good news for us though, what's Port Elizabeth like? What are my chances of getting murdered if I follow my team for a sneaky long weekend away?
 
Jockstap said:
Good news for us though, what's Port Elizabeth like? What are my chances of getting murdered if I follow my team for a sneaky long weekend away?
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PE is known as the Friendly City, It's a real nice place to visit and has everything from sandy beaches, to casino's to museums, to whatever you want... And while you're going there, why not stop at the Bloukrans Bungee Jump just outside of the city. It's the highest Bungee Jumping bridge site...
 
First question

How does two remaining Derbies work for Italian, SA and Scottish sides? Does it just mean they a home and away against two sides in the other conference? So an Italian team will play a Scottish or SA side and the other Italian team will play the opposite nation?
 
I think the good thing is it splits the strengths of the relative nations giving each an 'equal' chance of making the top 3.

The real question is how much the Derbies will effect final group standings would Edinburgh prefer a third crack at Glasgow or a second against Lenister.

Of course until one season is played through no one will really know but all it does is drop 5 games from the season which is good player welfare wise. So the chances of 1 specific game affecting final standings will be unlikely. What your home and away games are could be also a problem. Getting Lenister home but Benetton away for a team like the Glasgow can have a huge effect on their chances.

Like I say though see what pans out at least the system isn't complex and I'm not a huge fan of conferences systems usually.



Be interesting to see if they realign the conferences every season as well based on performance. For instance if the conference B semi-final ends up being Ulster V Lenister (unlikely) will they split them next year but no Irish team makes the playoffs in A?
 
ncurd said:
I think the good thing is it splits the strengths of the relative nations giving each an 'equal' chance of making the top 3.

The real question is how much the Derbies will effect final group standings would Edinburgh prefer a third crack at Glasgow or a second against Lenister.

Of course until one season is played through no one will really know but all it does is drop 5 games from the season which is good player welfare wise. So the chances of 1 specific game affecting final standings will be unlikely. What your home and away games are could be also a problem. Getting Lenister home but Benetton away for a team like the Glasgow can have a huge effect on their chances.

Like I say though see what pans out at least the system isn't complex and I'm not a huge fan of conferences systems usually.



Be interesting to see if they realign the conferences every season as well based on performance. For instance if the conference B semi-final ends up being Ulster V Lenister (unlikely) will they split them next year but no Irish team makes the playoffs in A?
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It's impossible to be a Leinster v Ulster semifinal.
But they are basing it on previous sradons results regards conference.
Also they've addressed player welfare and planned it well.
Fair play to them for taking gamble and I think they've done very well with majority of planning. I think it makes every game meaningful and interesting now too.
 
Glad theyve provisioned in the derbies. Looking forward to the future of this competition in a big way.
 
Mental. A competition without identify. Spectators aren't stupid.

We need less cross border rugby, not more.
 
Most interesting thing I find in the Guinness Pro12 statement is:

South African clubs will not be eligible to qualify for EPCR tournaments at present
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Now that suggests to me there is scope to include them and could lead to club tournaments running in line together with a future 'clubs winners' match.

Reason because of the global season ambition?

Old Hooker said:
Mental. A competition without identify. Spectators aren't stupid.

We need less cross border rugby, not more.
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Without identity? You have got to me kidding me.

Less cross border rugby? We need more global scope for rugby
 
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Old Hooker said:
Mental. A competition without identify. Spectators aren't stupid.

We need less cross border rugby, not more.
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It was always cross border. This just has made it in my eyes a vastly more exciting and interesting format.

I for 1 welcome the 2 teams and look forward to seeing how they go. I've always liked the Cheetahs.
 
munstermuffin said:
It was always cross border. This just has made it in my eyes a vastly more exciting and interesting format.

I for 1 welcome the 2 teams and look forward to seeing how they go. I've always liked the Cheetahs.
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Cross border's one thing, cross continental quite another.

The format feels convoluted. Don't like the conference system and some teams playing each other 3 times in 21 games smacks of Scottish football.

Don't know why I'm getting so exercised about this, I seldom watch much of it anyway.
 

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