England 2023/24

[Vieux Talonneur]

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Premiership team of the season. Only 2 players (3 if you count Lawes) un eligible to play for England.

If you replace Du Toit and Wiese would this be a good england team? It's a good mix there.

And only two of them were in England's RWC squad. Half of whom have now retired.

Knackered players?

Lousy selections?

Wealth of emerging talent?

Premiership form is no guide to international succcess?

Gone to France?

Don't agree with choice anyway?

Discuss.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

The world cup isn't this summer so means literally nothing

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

A lot of them were either in the 6 nations squad or in the England A team from memory.

The main thing it shows me is that we have a load of English talent and for once it seems to be fairly represented in the England set up.

 

[BPM]

And only two of them were in England's RWC squad. Half of whom have now retired.

Knackered players?

Lousy selections?

Wealth of emerging talent?

Premiership form is no guide to international succcess?

Gone to France?

Don't agree with choice anyway?

Discuss.

Well let's make it fair to begin with … 4 of the players in the side are not English so wouldn't have been eligible for selection anyway and as you already said, 2 were in the squad, so we're actually only debating 9 players.

If I had to pick one of your reasons above, it would be 'wealth of emerging talent'. It's been a breakthrough season for Baxter, Tuima and IFW. None of them would have been in the conversation for the RWC (rightly so).

Fin Smith, Slade and Coles were all in the extended squad and close to going, but Slade was the only one who would realistically have expected to be there. Moreover, I don't think it was overly contentious that he didn't go given Marchant was available and in better form.

Spencer has had chances with England and has never taken them. Arguably he's been hard done by over the years, but whether or not he should have been in the RWC squad as a third choice is a bit of a redundant argument anyway.

Sleightholme has always been rated, but until his season injury has been his biggest enemy. He could have been in the frame before now, but truthfully I don't recall him putting in a consistent enough run of games to press his case before now.

Langdon is the big miss for me. His form this season has been excellent, but that's not a flash in the pan as he's been consistently good for some time. Given that Walker has barely seen any game time and apparently isn't trusted, I'm not really sure why he keeps getting picked. Hopefully Langdon gets a deserved chance this summer.

As @TRF_Olyy intimated, RWC selection was over 6mths ago now so judging that on players' current form to stoke up a bit of controversy/question the competency of the coaching set up is a bit strange.

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

I was being totally, well mostly, facetious in my questions. Must remember to add smilies…..

It's great though to see Baxter, Langdon, F Smith, Sleightholme and IFW in there. All should have big parts to play with England in future. Slade's a player reborn and Spencer should have had more England chances. Tuima and Coles have gone well although, barring injuries, I don't see either as more than peripheral to England plans for the forseeable.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

When's the first training squad? This weekend?
Usually one without the Play off teams

Would take a 36 man squad of
1. Baxter, Marler Brantingham,
2. Walker, Riley, Blake
3. Cole, Heyes, Painter (Get fitness tests in)
4. Martin, Tuima,
5. Batley, Carnduff,
6. CCS, Roots,
7. Pepper, Evans,
8. Dombrandt, Fisilau,
9. JVP, Randall, Porter
10. M.Smith, Skinner, Johnson,
11. IFW, OHC,
12. Kelly, Northmore, Williams
13. Slade, Beard,
14. Murley, Heward
15. Steward, Redshaw,

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Genge out for the summer....

 

[TRF_Olyy]

That's a shame, though think it works out best for England in the long run as we can get minutes into whoever's next in line instead of just using Genge/Marler for every test

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

That's a shame, though think it works out best for England in the long run as we can get minutes into whoever's next in line instead of just using Genge/Marler for every test

Is Marler likely to be available? He doesn't like being away and has said he's retiring next year anyway. That said, he's on something like 92 caps now so maybe tempted to sign off after a ton?

Big summer ahead for Baxter.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

He's not said he isn't available, and with a few others ruling themselves out post RWC he's had the opportunity to so I'm just presuming he is until he isn't

 

[BPM]

When's the first training squad? This weekend?
Usually one without the Play off teams

Would take a 36 man squad of
1. Baxter, Marler Brantingham,
2. Walker, Riley, Blake
3. Cole, Heyes, Painter (Get fitness tests in)
4. Martin, Tuima,
5. Batley, Carnduff,
6. CCS, Roots,
7. Pepper, Evans,
8. Dombrandt, Fisilau,
9. JVP, Randall, Porter
10. M.Smith, Skinner, Johnson,
11. IFW, OHC,
12. Kelly, Northmore, Williams
13. Slade, Beard,
14. Murley, Heward
15. Steward, Redshaw,

I mostly like this although I'd make the following swaps:

Blamire > Walker
Atkinson > Skinner
Thorley > Heward
Mercer > Beard

Obviously I'm not suggesting Mercer as a centre or Atkinson as a 10.

As a Quins fan, Walker and Beard are out for me. It might only be a training squad but both have been noticeably poor in the second half of the season.

In contrast, I think the players I've suggested have done individually well in weaker sides.

 

[AngloScotsHybrid]

Im hearing Arthur Clarke has been selected in the England squad. A trip to New Zealand would be an Odyssey for him.

 

[Scotty]

When is the squad set to be announced?

 

[AngloScotsHybrid]

When is the squad set to be announced?

Sunday afternoon

 

[Which Tyler]

Anyone know when the actual squad will be announced?
This weekend is (IIRC) just the first training squad - absent any players from Saints, Bath, Sale & Sarries.

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

Im hearing Arthur Clarke has been selected in the England squad. A trip to New Zealand would be an Odyssey for him.

Groan!

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

Was Arthur Clarke the lad that couldn't even get a game for Gloucester and went on loan to Quins?

What's he offer out of curiosity? Big lock? Mobile lock? Crap lock?

 

[Which Tyler]

Was Arthur Clarke the lad that couldn't even get a game for Gloucester and went on loan to Quins?

What's he offer out of curiosity? Big lock? Mobile lock? Crap lock?

an opportunity for a bad pun

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Was Arthur Clarke the lad that couldn't even get a game for Gloucester and went on loan to Quins?

What's he offer out of curiosity? Big lock? Mobile lock? Crap lock?

It's confusing cause there's two Clarke's at Gloucester in the second row atm too

 

[Crash Hamster]

Currently watching England U20 getting absolutely knobbed by Coventry. It confirms nicely that being U20 6N champions doesn't count for much at senior level.