Springbok issues

[TRF_heineken]

Latest media reports suggest that AC will stay on as head coach but that Johan van Graan and Mzwandile Stick will be axed.

They were the 2 members on the coaching team that AC didn't appoint and was SARU appointments. Van Graan, who was the only survivor of Heyneke Meyer's coaching team, was still under contract with SARU when AC was appointed, so he was basically kept on.

Mzwandile Stick. A lot has been said about him and his appointment. I don't think it's necessary to go into more detail on him, and the sooner he f**** off the better.

But I don't know if that will be an improvement. Many pundits say that AC himself is poor, and that his selection choices and plans are poor.

 

[George Ford]

Gavin Rich's latest article suggests otherwise:
" I am hearing that Allister Coetzee is gone, that the stake-holders have just had enough.. " - http://www.supersport.com/rugby/blogs/gavin-rich/Too_much_risk_in_status_quo

On the pundits, I don't always agree with Nick Mallett, but one particular comment I liked which he made after the Italy game indirectly pointed out the incompetence of a governing body (or the individuals) in charge of South African Rugby.

What respectable international coach would after the kind of year the Boks had, still be defiant in saying that he won't stand down (in a way echoing his president's stance)?!

Nick Mallett simply said the following:
" ..I feel dreadfully sorry for Allister, because he is a lovely guy. I know him personally and he is a decent person. But you are appointed to win Test matches for South Africa, not to win a popularity contest. But he has a four-year contract, so why should he resign? If there is no performance clause in his contract, why on earth would he walk away? We have to ask why wasn’t he appointed just for two years and why was there no performance clause for this year? Every other professional coach gets that clause" - http://www.sarugbymag.co.za/blog/details/its-been-a-dreadful-season - Nick obviously watched AC's post match conference and could only question the latter's dick-headedness talking about singing a 4-year contract and intend on finishing it must come from somewhere.

Indeed SA Rugby's struggles goes beyond the field of play and a management change, but if AC truly regarded himself as a top coach of the game then he should know that based on this dreadful year he must do the honorable thing.

'Bok coach Coetzee given the boot' is the only rugby headlines I want to hear for the remainder of this forgotten year.

 

[sharkfan]

Even if Allister Coetzee is fired, who is going to replace him? I doubt that anyone else would want the Bok coaching position at the moment with all the BS going on.

 

[TRF_heineken]

Even if Allister Coetzee is fired, who is going to replace him? I doubt that anyone else would want the Bok coaching position at the moment with all the BS going on.

I think it's the perfect opportunity for any ambitious coach to take the hot seat. And he will most probably be allowed to make a few demands too.

Plus, even if he loses a few games, but shows improvement, it will be better than 2016.

 

[George Ford]

I think it's the perfect opportunity for any ambitious coach to take the hot seat. And he will most probably be allowed to make a few demands too.

Plus, even if he loses a few games, but shows improvement, it will be better than 2016.

Agreed - I actually think a few of our local coaches does have what it takes to put us right up there again.

AC is past his years. The game has evolved past the time when his expertise might have worked - he should've gotten the top job during P. Divvy's time.

It's worth noting how the Cheetahs team had an invincible Currie Cup campaign after a dismal showing in SR. Sure they had continuity going for them in terms of player-personnel in comparison, but a lot of their success should be attributable to a shift in mindset. They blew opponents away with their constant attack and as a result breaching the gainline, creating opportunities and thus outscoring teams, just like the Lions did in SR. The type of rugby which breeds confidence in the players abilities and the gameplan.

I wouldn't say the Cheetahs just completely copied the Lions template, rather or perhaps the approach to every game week in week out, preparation and conditioning differing from team to team of course. A fundamental approach to playing the game to it's objectives, how your style encompasses the laws of the game playing into your hands, etc. Putting emphasis on core skills, execution and defensive drills and putting in place specialist personnel who consistently work on these areas for continuous monitoring and improvement.

I think it's worth entertaining the thought of a Johann Ackerman being at the helm. The one thing he had going for him as a mentor this year was how he was able to bring the best out of otherwise under-rated and ordinary players. He made mince meat of the highly acclaimed NZ teams in consecutive weeks. With a bigger talent pool of players to select from and more resources, a team coached by him can only go from strength to strength I believe.

I don't think all in SA is a lost cause, don't let the Toeties' and Rudolph Strauli's of SA paint a bleak picture. The success was (is) there for us to have, we have the talent and quality. We just need the right coach with the right attitude to instill the right culture again.

 

[Jan1]

If SARU wants to move to a more running game then AC cant stay. He is useless otherwise anyway. So I don't believe he is suited to any gameplan watsoever. He was good at WP because of Rassie. Look at what Rassie is doing now at munster. SARU was stupid not to appoint Rassie as coach on a permanent basis, he was in the setup for more than 4 years. Ackerman should then have been appointed after Rassie.

What's going to happen now is that AC will stay on because nobody would want the job. The ideal would be for a guy like Dawie Theron to take over now until Ackerman has made the lions a consistant title chalenger for the Super Rugby. Dawie has coached almost every single player currently in the springbok setup so he knows how to get the best out of the players.

 

[TRF_heineken]

I see the latest reports suggests that Dave Rennie is in the pipeline to succeed AC...

http://www.sport24.co.za/Rugby/Springboks/kiwi-coach-linked-to-springbok-job-20161205

 

[saulan]

I see the latest reports suggests that Dave Rennie is in the pipeline to succeed AC...

http://www.sport24.co.za/Rugby/Springboks/kiwi-coach-linked-to-springbok-job-20161205

The main thing that stands out to me is the cost to buy out AC. R13m which will require Supersport funds. The comments made by Mallett (I think it was) stating that it is crazy that there isn't a performance clause built into this contract is bizarre. I am under the assumption that it is standard practice and it is odd that it was omitted from the contract.

Also annoyed by AC. Yes he is fully entitled to stay since he has a contract, but he has been beyond woeful this year and has shown only regression over the year. The fact that he will only leave if he is forced out despite his terrible showing makes me lose respect for him and shows he really is just in this for himself. I'm also sick of his rhetoric of it will be better and the guys are focused prior to every match and then having the same level of performance week in and week out (and also making sure he takes no responsibility for any of it).

- - - Updated - - -

Also, the Munster boys are not going to like the fact that Rassie Erasmus is getting mentioned, it seems he has really turned things around for them over the past year. (Don't think he will come back though, I think he left SA because he was over all the politics, don't know why he would leave such a good thing he has going to return to it all.)

 

[TRF_heineken]

The main thing that stands out to me is the cost to buy out AC. R13m which will require Supersport funds. The comments made by Mallett (I think it was) stating that it is crazy that there isn't a performance clause built into this contract is bizarre. I am under the assumption that it is standard practice and it is odd that it was omitted from the contract.

Also annoyed by AC. Yes he is fully entitled to stay since he has a contract, but he has been beyond woeful this year and has shown only regression over the year. The fact that he will only leave if he is forced out despite his terrible showing makes me lose respect for him and shows he really is just in this for himself. I'm also sick of his rhetoric of it will be better and the guys are focused prior to every match and then having the same level of performance week in and week out (and also making sure he takes no responsibility for any of it).

- - - Updated - - -

Also, the Munster boys are not going to like the fact that Rassie Erasmus is getting mentioned, it seems he has really turned things around for them over the past year. (Don't think he will come back though, I think he left SA because he was over all the politics, don't know why he would leave such a good thing he has going to return to it all.)

The Golden Handshake. Something that has been used too much in SA at top level positions. AC will just be another one.

My question is what is going to happen if AC stays on? I have the suspicion that main Sponsor, Blue Label Telecoms will then withdraw their support, which will put SARU under more financial pressure.

If we appoint a new team of coaches, would this also mean that new sponsors would come to the party?? Could we see a return of big sponsors like Castle, or ABSA?? Or one of their competitors??

I think SARU doesn't have much of a choice here. They have to look at the bigger picture. And so what if it angers the ANC?? they have bigger problems of their own at the moment, they shouldn't waste their energy on Rugby. If Supersport assists SARU with the buyout, I think it would just be fair if they have a say in the matter on what happens next. Supersport is sitting with employees who could be the best rugby think-tank any nation could have. And with their tech they can easily improve plans and tactics for the Boks.

 

[JohnKA]

I really like the idea of Dave Rennie as bok coach , we need fresh ideas and someone to help change the SA rugby mind set or just to get us going into the right direction , but then again the ANC will not like this because they want a BEE coach so i wont even be suprised to see bloody Stick as the next coach , if SARU is really thinking about those coaches i believe they are moving into the right direction .

 

[Bruce_ma gooshvili]

Sorry guys, Rennie signed up for the Glasgow Warriors a couple of months ago and will start in June 2016. Some of the rugby news sources in the SH seem very unreliable to me.

 

[JohnKA]

Sorry guys, Rennie signed up for the Glasgow Warriors a couple of months ago and will start in June 2016. Some of the rugby news sources in the SH seem very unreliable to me.

Guess we have to settle for Stick then ..... lol

 

[WaterboySA]

And Eddie Jones signed up to coach the Stormers in Cape Town,and THAT did not happen.....

 

[JohnKA]

And Eddie Jones signed up to coach the Stormers in Cape Town,and THAT did not happen.....

Yeah .... i am glad that never really happend i would hate the Stormers playing good rugby then they would beat my lil sharks way to badly !! .... Rassie wont leave what he has now i think not for the bokke anyway , Jake is without a job but is ill in hospital i saw in news24 , so the stress would be too much for his health

 

[saulan]

Sorry guys, Rennie signed up for the Glasgow Warriors a couple of months ago and will start in June 2016. Some of the rugby news sources in the SH seem very unreliable to me.

As a Stormers supporter I don't think that means anything until he actually starts after what we experienced with Jones.

 

[JohnKA]

As a Stormers supporter I don't think that means anything until he actually starts after what we experienced with Jones.

But why would he want to coach the Boks ? .... i would really like if he does but it is almost to good to think of him even as a option , i think AC will still be here 2017 and world cup.

 

[ClarenceW]

Hey guys! AC is not going anywhere. He has no intention of leaving and with SARU in a mess they will not even be able to give him a golden handshake. All I can see happening is the assistant coaches are gonna get fired. I also think the new coaches will run the show and AC will get the credit for the turnaround. While we can all hope that he gets get the chop I'm more realistic in thinking that it won't happen.

 

[JohnKA]

Hey guys! AC is not going anywhere. He has no intention of leaving and with SARU in a mess they will not even be able to give him a golden handshake. All I can see happening is the assistant coaches are gonna get fired. I also think the new coaches will run the show and AC will get the credit for the turnaround. While we can all hope that he gets get the chop I'm more realistic in thinking that it won't happen.

This is true i guess , but we can dream !!

 

[saulan]

But why would he want to coach the Boks ? .... i would really like if he does but it is almost to good to think of him even as a option , i think AC will still be here 2017 and world cup.

I don't actually think he is an option, I think he is a nice option for Saru to think about, but there just isn't enough security SARU can provide with respect to politics keeping out of strategy, appointments and selection to make it worth his while. A foreign coach who is charged with winning games is not going to be interested in enforcing player and coaching quotas.

As to what he could have gotten out of it, he would get international coaching experience. Both current and former New Zealand coaches had had decent spells coaching the Welsh side before taking over at the All Blacks. I think that would be a highly appealing factor for him, but I don't think that the added challenges surrounding coaching the Boks at the moment makes it worth it from his perspective.

 

[TRF_heineken]

I don't actually think he is an option, I think he is a nice option for Saru to think about, but there just isn't enough security SARU can provide with respect to politics keeping out of strategy, appointments and selection to make it worth his while. A foreign coach who is charged with winning games is not going to be interested in enforcing player and coaching quotas.

As to what he could have gotten out of it, he would get international coaching experience. Both current and former New Zealand coaches had had decent spells coaching the Welsh side before taking over at the All Blacks. I think that would be a highly appealing factor for him, but I don't think that the added challenges surrounding coaching the Boks at the moment makes it worth it from his perspective.

While this might be true. We have already seen SARU recently giving Government the finger in still apllying to host the RWC in 2023, even after the Minister said he has put a ban on it. Maybe this is the start of a trend. If we get an overseas coach, maybe one of the agreements would perhaps be that he can pick anyone he wants, regardless of race or if they're playing abroad or in SA.

But all these articles are merely speculation at the moment, as we will have to wait and see what happens on the 9th.