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Springbok issues

I don't actually think he is an option, I think he is a nice option for Saru to think about, but there just isn't enough security SARU can provide with respect to politics keeping out of strategy, appointments and selection to make it worth his while. A foreign coach who is charged with winning games is not going to be interested in enforcing player and coaching quotas.

As to what he could have gotten out of it, he would get international coaching experience. Both current and former New Zealand coaches had had decent spells coaching the Welsh side before taking over at the All Blacks. I think that would be a highly appealing factor for him, but I don't think that the added challenges surrounding coaching the Boks at the moment makes it worth it from his perspective.

I agree with this 100% but i dont even think the experience will be enough to pull any decent foreign coach , the politics is chasing them all away , think if we had to politic intervension the coaches that will apply for the bok job .

The quota system is also so bloody stupid you cant enforce it on the international stage it has to come from school level but thats old news , thing is a lot of the non white players do deserve to be with the boks but the quota system provides exstra presure on them , they now have the stress of doing well for their country and proving they are there on merit the international presure is enough already , so this system is in my opinion dividing the country into racism again and making it harder for non white players to perform and that is sad.

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While this might be true. We have already seen SARU recently giving Government the finger in still apllying to host the RWC in 2023, even after the Minister said he has put a ban on it. Maybe this is the start of a trend. If we get an overseas coach, maybe one of the agreements would perhaps be that he can pick anyone he wants, regardless of race or if they're playing abroad or in SA.

But all these articles are merely speculation at the moment, as we will have to wait and see what happens on the 9th.

It does look and sound like things are starting to turn the right way at SARU , does anyone know how much say the sport minister really have over our rugby ?
 
It does look and sound like things are starting to turn the right way at SARU , does anyone know how much say the sport minister really have over our rugby ?

That is a good question. The other question is what could happen if SARU doesn't abide by his rules?? And what is the legitimacy of the rule-making process.

Most of the time Fikile Razzmatazz Mbalula says a lot, but we hardly see any of it being constituted to written form...
 
The idea of Rennie is good but i cant see it happening.
1. He is a foreign coach and SARU has given no indication that they are about to change their policy. Saru will remain conservative. If they fire the coaches they will leave it until the new springbok season almost starts then they will say the coaches did not have enough time to prepare hence the failure.
2. Why would a foreign coach and especialy a New Zealander who knows what we have to deal with in terms of politics take charge? add to that the fact that we will most likely be offering him less than Glasgow.
3. Im sure Rennie said he has aspirations to coach the All Blacks. If he takes this job it might jeopardize that. Either they will condemn him for coaching a rival or he fails with the systems Saru and the political environment gives him which will make him an undesirable candidate for the All Blacks.
4. His contract with the Scottish side runs out when Steve Hansens contract is due to expire
 
That is a good question. The other question is what could happen if SARU doesn't abide by his rules?? And what is the legitimacy of the rule-making process.

Most of the time Fikile Razzmatazz Mbalula says a lot, but we hardly see any of it being constituted to written form...

Well as you have stated they did bid for the world cup anyway and nothing happened that we know about , if there was trouble i am sure the media would know about it Frikkie is a very outspoken person
 
It does look and sound like things are starting to turn the right way at SARU , does anyone know how much say the sport minister really have over our rugby ?

I believe his say is near on absolute.
The only way he could be swayed away from his political agenda is if there was enough of a financial incentive for him to do so. We must not lose sight of the fact that the ruling elite are determined to achieve an ideological state of being while simultaneously choosing to abandon that charter if there is personal gain to be had. It is this fundamental that has led to the failure of so much in SA society and SA Rugby is not exempt from this tyranny.

Do not for one moment assume that common sense and social conscience will prevail. We have all seen too much over the past 25 years to know that things are not going to change for the benefit of all anytime soon.
 
I don't know what you guys are on about, he's doing a great job.

Remember we only lost these away games because Jake White decided not to send our best players overseas, we're going to take the cup in October. I guarantee it.
 
I don't know what you guys are on about, he's doing a great job.

Remember we only lost these away games because Jake White decided not to send our best players overseas, we're going to take the cup in October. I guarantee it.

Wat rook jy!!
 
SARU General Council meeting today - wonder if we will be getting a statement later?
 
SARU General Council meeting today - wonder if we will be getting a statement later?

And here is that said statement:
http://www.sport24.co.za/Rugby/sa-rugby-makes-ground-breaking-decisions-20161209

Key changes approved were:
• Permitting 74% shareholdings in commercial arms of rugby unions by private equity partners
• Increasing the make-up of the independent and player representation on the Executive Council to five independents with six elected members
• Introducing new committees for franchise (Vodacom Super Rugby) and non-franchise rugby to focus and streamline decision making
• Moving responsibility for the appointment of the Springbok coach and CEO from the General Council to the Executive Council
• Removing the selection committee while retaining a selection convenor to work with national team coaches
• Aligning with the country’s geopolitical boundaries by moving to nine members of SA Rugby, while retaining 14 playing unions
• Reducing the presidential roles from three to two by removing the vice presidency from 2018
“We have made a number of major decisions today that over time we believe will contribute to making South African rugby stronger and therefore assist the Springboks,†said Alexander.
“The Council decided to open the door for greater private equity investment in rugby and greater business involvement to help recapitalise the game.
“We make no secret of the fact that in these tough economic times the rugby business is taking the same strain that every other South African business is facing. There is a battle to find and retain sponsors and supporters and we could not continue to do business in the same way. Rugby needed to make major decisions today to find new ways of doing things today and we have done that.â€
 
Thanks Saulan

• Permitting 74% shareholdings in commercial arms of rugby unions by private equity partners.

== As long as it doesn't become another corrupt scheme for the tjommies to line their pockets with kick backs and bribes. If the investment doesn't make its way to the players and their retention for the domestic game - then it's all for nothing.


• Increasing the make-up of the independent and player representation on the Executive Council to five independents with six elected members.

== I guess to pass a motion they only need 50% so elected members will still make up the majority votes and they will be responsible for the appointment of the CEO and coach.
I agree with a more balanced exec and I guess this goes some way towards that - just hope the independents and player rep are untouchable.


• Introducing new committees for franchise (Vodacom Super Rugby) and non-franchise rugby to focus and streamline decision making.

== Finally some good news - definitely a more co-ordinated approach needed.


• Moving responsibility for the appointment of the Springbok coach and CEO from the General Council to the Executive Council.

== Good result - though elected hold the power and may be swayed by self preservation and easily coerced to do the political bidding of others.


• Removing the selection committee while retaining a selection convenor to work with national team coaches.

== I suspect this is designed to keep the political agenda on track regarding targets 2019.


• Aligning with the country’s geopolitical boundaries by moving to nine members of SA Rugby, while retaining 14 playing unions

== Agree the larger unions need greater say over smaller unions.


• Reducing the presidential roles from three to two by removing the vice presidency from 2018

== To what end? I don't have a problem with this - I just fail to see any direct or indirect benefits re "state of play"
 
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I hope you don't mind, but I'm just going to add-on to what you already said.

• Permitting 74% shareholdings in commercial arms of rugby unions by private equity partners.

== As long as it doesn't become another corrupt scheme for the tjommies to line their pockets with kick backs and bribes. If the investment doesn't make its way to the players and their retention for the domestic game - then it's all for nothing.

I think actually it's going to prevent the kick-backs from happening. The private sector will be under more scrutiny with regard to payments and using the funds. And on the other hand, the investors will want to see value and returns on their investments.

And that will inevitably be results on the field.

• Increasing the make-up of the independent and player representation on the Executive Council to five independents with six elected members.

== I guess to pass a motion they only need 50% so elected members will still make up the majority votes and they will be responsible for the appointment of the CEO and coach.
I agree with a more balanced exec and I guess this goes some way towards that - just hope the independents and player rep are untouchable.

I think this will increase the player welfare aspect in decisions being made.

• Introducing new committees for franchise (Vodacom Super Rugby) and non-franchise rugby to focus and streamline decision making.

== Finally some good news - definitely a more co-ordinated approach needed.

Agreed, hopefully the big unions (which are in charge of the Super Rugby Franchises), will get more sway with the board, and not get constantly bullied by the smaller unions.


• Moving responsibility for the appointment of the Springbok coach and CEO from the General Council to the Executive Council.

== Good result - though elected hold the power and may be swayed by self preservation and easily coerced to do the political bidding of others.

Pity this didn't happen earlier. It will bring in more pressure on selecting the right coach AND assistant coaches!


• Removing the selection committee while retaining a selection convenor to work with national team coaches.

== I suspect this is designed to keep the political agenda on track regarding targets 2019.

Would it though? The role of the convenor would be more to as an advisory role, the National team coaches will still select the team. Perhaps this will prevent us from selecting overseas based players who aren't in form at the moment.

• Aligning with the country's geopolitical boundaries by moving to nine members of SA Rugby, while retaining 14 playing unions

== Agree the larger unions need greater say over smaller unions.

Again, finally this has happened. I guess there was some form of inevitability to this when the Bulls signed agreements with Border and Boland.


• Reducing the presidential roles from three to two by removing the vice presidency from 2018

== To what end? I don't have a problem with this - I just fail to see any direct or indirect benefits re "state of play"

One less big salary to be paid... But my question would be, what was the vice president's role in the first place?
 
Today is D-day for Coetzee isn't it? Sounds like he is staying, although given the rumours over the last few weeks, I would love to be surprised.

Does anyone know what Fourie du Preez is up to in life at the moment? I think we need someone like him as part of the set up. Like Venter, I would like to see Kolbe tried at SH. If he were guided by someone like FdP, he could be lethal.
 
Today is D-day for Coetzee isn't it? Sounds like he is staying, although given the rumours over the last few weeks, I would love to be surprised.

Does anyone know what Fourie du Preez is up to in life at the moment? I think we need someone like him as part of the set up. Like Venter, I would like to see Kolbe tried at SH. If he were guided by someone like FdP, he could be lethal.

I think C Reinach is the way forward at SH for thr boks just need to work on that passing

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I would like to see this backline play :

9 - C Reinach
10 - H Pollard
11 - J Ulengo
12 - R v Rensburg
13 - F Venter
14 - R Combrinck
15 - P Lambie
 
Like Venter, I would like to see Kolbe tried at SH. If he were guided by someone like FdP, he could be lethal.

I think it was Mallett who wants him tried at Scrum half. Any timeline for today's events chez SARU?
 
Today is D-day for Coetzee isn't it? Sounds like he is staying, although given the rumours over the last few weeks, I would love to be surprised.

Does anyone know what Fourie du Preez is up to in life at the moment? I think we need someone like him as part of the set up. Like Venter, I would like to see Kolbe tried at SH. If he were guided by someone like FdP, he could be lethal.

Yesterday AC, and 3 senior players, Adriaan Strauss, Tendai Mtawarira and Pat Lambie reported back to SARU regarding the 2016 season. I think we'll either hear tomorrow or next week on which coach will stay and who will go.

As for Fourie Du Preez, last I heard was he was still playing in Japan, but that it's his final season. There's a rumour going around that he'll be doing consulting work with the Bulls and TUKS Varsity Cup team next year.
 

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