[2015 RWC] Final: New Zealand vs. Australia (31/10/2015)

[austingtir]

Why would the ARU fire Cheika? Seems like he did a good job turning the ship around. Things were pretty disastrous towards the end of the McKenzie era. I'm far away from Oz, but from my vantage point, it seems like he's got the team believing in themselves again.

Cheika will still be around. I just hope he's not smart enough to work out that Pocock should be at 7 and he needs to find genuine 8,6 locks and flyhalf before the next WC.

 

[Mcfadden]

My only gripe is the way NZ got such a **** easy pool stage. Maybe next WC they should decide on who plays who in the pool stage a few months before the WC actually starts, not 2 years before the tournament.

That can also work against you though. In 2007 one of the gripes was, aside from playing stupid ariel ping-pong with the French, was that we were undercooked with an overly easy pool. We dropped a few passes in our pool games this year which is schoolboy error stuff, but we were also holding back on a fair bit as well. The way Hansen approached each match was very well thought out and clearly he planned ahead. If you don't plan strategically like that, then having an 'easy' pool can be a negative.

 

[KeyboardWorrier]

That can also work against you though. In 2007 one of the gripes was, aside from playing stupid ariel ping-pong with the French, was that we were undercooked with an overly easy pool. We dropped a few passes in our pool games this year which is schoolboy error stuff, but we were also holding back on a fair bit as well. The way Hansen approached each match was very well thought out and clearly he planned ahead. If you don't plan strategically like that, then having an 'easy' pool can be a negative.

Very true. That answer nullifies this whole 'NZ got an easy pool stage' rubbish. You could see The All Blacks had to 'create pressure' to keep themselves in-check in those matches. That's hard, and presents its own challenges.

... certainly much harder than facing a dude English and Welsh side...

 

[Larksea]

yeah the 07 pool was an absolute joke for NZ and it was made even worse by Scotland running out a B side and opening their legs up. The minos they played all they did was try and disrupt the ab's

we actually had a tough pool, Argentina are obviously a much better team that people gave credit for and Tonga were very very physical and were very strong against the AB's.

 

[Tony Manx]

Let me start by saying that this AB team had the potential to be the best team ever yet only really showed it for an hour in that wonderful performance against a poor France!

It would have been an utter surprise had they not won the cup this RwC and only the superstitious KiwiSupporters really, deep down, believed anyone else would win it!

The game itself did not showcase the attributes that they have to their best with far too many mistakes.

Credit to the Aussies for sticking to their tasks but for the neutral it was ok but not magnificent!

Well done AB's and it will be a long time before you will actually have real competition.......

Now can we get over it and let the kiwis have their dues as bragging rights for a few days and get on with parochial stuff!!!

 

[smartcooky]

Some of the posters on here (kiwis, aussies and neutrals alike) need to take a long hard look at themselves. You all know who you are you bunch of w@nkers. If you want to carry on like that, fack off to Planet Rugby and join the rest of the arseholes where you belong... you're not welcome here!!!

Its high time the mods dealt with some of the vitriolic crap and personal taunts being dished out on this forum.

 

[Crazy Horse]

We've had a lot of discussion on the departing ABs and that there's a pretty good group of young up-and-coming players to take their place.

Who's leaving for greener pastures on the Aussie side? And who's up and coming to replace them?

 

[smartcooky]

Now, back to the rugby.

I think some of the mind games the Aussies were indulging in backfired on them a little. All the pre-match talk was about how the Wallabies had a massive, almost unbeatable loose forward trio and about how they would win the the vital battle of the breakdown with Popcock dominating.

Well it didn't work out that way. Pocock was largely anonymous in this match; he didn't win a single turnover, and was not able to effectively slow down NZ ball at tackle. This was achieved by emplying the same tactics that they used successfully in the 2011 semi-final against Australia. When in possesion, they made sure, where possible that they went the other way to where Pocock was, and where not possible, cleaners were following the ball closely ready to clean him out the moment the tackler was taken to ground. They made sure that when they were tackled by him, they went to ground past him (or a cleaner would make sure he pushed the ball carrier past him) before Pocock had a chance to go to ground himself, making him a tackle assist and not a tackler, and thereby forcing him to go through the gate. When not in possession, they made sure a cleaner was ready whenever Pocock looked like he might be ready to join.

The reality is that the loose forward trio of Kaino, McCaw and Read hands down won breakdown, and by some margin too. Between them, the Aussie trio made one breakdown turnover, and that was by Fardy. The NZ trio made four, three of them by Read, and they were often a vital points of the match.

Another thing that will satify the All Blacks is their set piece. I said before the game that the All Blacks should not be afraid to put the ball into touch and back their line-out, because I saw the Wallaby lineout as a weakness. That turned out to be true.


[TABLE="width: 455, align: center"]
<tbody>[TR="class: liveTblRowWht"]
[TD="class: liveTblTextBlk, colspan: 3"]

Set pieces


Wallabies................................................... All Blacks
​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="class: liveTblRowGry"]
[TD="class: liveTblColCtr"] 4 won, 1 lost (80.0%)[/TD]
[TD="class: liveTblTextGrn"]Scrums on own feed[/TD]
[TD="class: liveTblColCtr"] 3 won, 0 lost (100.0%)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="class: liveTblRowWht"]
[TD="class: liveTblColCtr"] 7 won, 3 lost (70.0%)[/TD]
[TD="class: liveTblTextGrn"]Lineouts on own throw[/TD]
[TD="class: liveTblColCtr"] 14 won, 0 lost (100.0%)
[/TD]
[/TR]
</tbody>[/TABLE]

The All Blacks won the set piece 100%. I don't think that has happened for a while!

 

[KeyboardWorrier]

Some of the posters on here (kiwis, aussies and neutrals alike) need to take a long hard look at themselves. You all know who you are you bunch of w@nkers. If you want to carry on like that, fack off to Planet Rugby and join the rest of the arseholes where you belong... you're not welcome here!!!

Its high time the mods dealt with some of the vitriolic crap and personal taunts being dished out on this forum.

I agree. Those TRF guys should be banned.

 

[smartcooky]

He knows he's finished.

What? Lets see....

He coaches the Waratahs to their first ever win in Super Rugby
He coaches the Wallabies to victory in the Rugby Championship
He coaches the Wallabies through the most difficult pool at RWC, coming out undefeated
He coaches his team all the way to the final, only to be beaten by a better side on the day.

Why would he be finished?

 

[Bazzy]

The All Blacks won the set piece 100%. I don't think that has happened for a while!

+1

Both Kaino and Read were excellent today and you can always count on McCaw. Winnings the breakdowns was massive today. We were able to get quick ball most of the game and that allowed DC to do what he does best.

 

[Crazy Horse]

McCaw decides to postpone retirement for 1 year so that he can win the RC next year along with the Bledisloe and then retire with all the hardware in the cupboard.

You heard it here first, fellas!

 

[Kiwi_]

McCaw decides to postpone retirement for 1 year so that he can win the RC next year along with the Bledisloe and then retire with all the hardware in the cupboard.

You heard it here first, fellas!

To be honest, I think that's a little bit of a sign of how weak we are to become.. Sam Cane ain't ready.. and if I'm going to be honest, I don't think he ever will be.

 

[Dirty Ape]

Refereeing

At first glance the referee seemed to be favouring us, especially in the first half. I have watched the match again and noted all of the questionable decisions:

1:57
A.Smith fires the ball at Whitelock who is not expecting it. Possible knock-on not called. May not have touched hand, may not have gone forward. Ref in better position to make call than the camera angle.
2:04
AAC in from the side? Not called. Followed immediately by Genia knock-on.
14:36
Savea break down left wing, caught by Pocock, then what looked like a fair turnover by Pocock/Hooper. 2 phases later McCaw strips ball from Fardy. Ref blows for knock-on by Savea. What knock-on?
18:05
Quick tap penalty by A.Smith, penalty against NZ for holding on as Pocock gets hands on ball. Pocock in from the side?
20:10
Sio late tackle on Carter. Discussion over whether penalty or not. Penalty awarded.
24:54
High tackle from Sio on Carter (forearm to chin). Penalty.
33:43
Milner-Skudder forward pass to Kaino not called. At next phase Genia is penalised for offside.
36:40
NZ lose ball in midfield. Ball bounces around off both black and yellow but no clear knock-on. Nothing called.
37:52
Possible accidental offside when Nonu runs into Carter. No advantage gained and nothing called.
44:27
Mitchell takes high ball and then SBW slaps ball out of his hand. Ruled knock-on against yellow.
46:09
Possible accidental offside when Milner-Skudder runs into McCaw. No advantage gained, nothing called.
48:02
Mitchell takes it in, McCaw turns it over. Pocock gets hands near ball before McCaw can push ball back. Ref points at Pocock and says "let it go now". Pocock keeps hands on ball and eventually Aus get the scrum.
51:42
Ben Smith yellow card. Definitely lifts well above horizontal but eases him to ground. Discussion with TMO about whether to make it penalty or yellow before giving yellow.
56.05
High tackle from Kaino on Pocock. Asks TMO repeatedly to look at it during live play. Calls advantage over 2 phases later 10m up field with yellow still in possession.
72:35
Scrum penalty to NZ. "Onto your knees yellow"


The forward pass in the 34th minute was clearly a mistake by the officials. The offside by Genia was not necessarily a direct result of the missed forward pass though. What happened after the kickoff is completely irrelevant.

The missed high tackle in the 57th minute did disadvantage Australia. Owens was clearly looking for assistance from the TMO here and got none. Advantage should have been continued longer than the 2 phases and 10m. Recall that Aus were the next team to score though so how much this affected the match is debateable.

The other "questionable" decisions (most of them were probably correct decisions, or marginal at worst) were fairly evenly spread.

So at 2nd viewing, the refereeing wasn't as bad as I first thought.

 

[Jaguares]

Congrats NZ! Well done

 

[Mcfadden]

I don't get the anti-Cane sentiment. Sure, he ain't McCaw, and never has come close to being that. Btw, isn't he like 23? He's probably more of a quiet work horse than that, but he definitely works. To me he's a bit better in the tight player and would probably be more well grounded than a guy like Ardie Savea. He tackles his guts out and that's backed up by the stats. He made a few fumbles last time which could have cost us the game, but it's not as if that's typical of the way he usually plays. I think we might be panicking again when we don't really need to.

 

[austingtir]

If Cane was any good he would of got Mccaws spot he hasnt and I reckon another 7 will turn up in the next couple of years. Cain might get the first look in but im almost certain he's not going to hold that position for more than a couple of years.

Hopefully someone like Ardie matures a bit soon. Personally I still think Matt Todd is the best 7 in NZ right now.

 

[Kiwi_]

I don't get the anti-Cane sentiment. Sure, he ain't McCaw, and never has come close to being that. Btw, isn't he like 23? He's probably more of a quiet work horse than that, but he definitely works. To me he's a bit better in the tight player and would probably be more well grounded than a guy like Ardie Savea. He tackles his guts out and that's backed up by the stats. He made a few fumbles last time which could have cost us the game, but it's not as if that's typical of the way he usually plays. I think we might be panicking again when we don't really need to.

Hey mate, he's a top player, don't be so sensitive about it too much. I just don't think he can hold the mantle after Richie goes.. Perhaps Hansens looking at some options and wants Richies guidance there to help him, which I'm more than happy about. Cane's a quality player, but I think we're going to struggle once Richie goes.

 

[Mcfadden]

If Cane was any good he would of got Mccaws spot he hasnt and I reckon another 7 will turn up in the next couple of years. Cain might get the first look in but im almost certain he's not going to hold that position for more than a couple of years.

Hopefully someone like Ardie matures a bit soon. Personally I still think Matt Todd is the best 7 in NZ right now.

Yeah I know you like Todd, and I agree on him. He has the make for international rugby imo. But nobody was going to push McCaw out of the team while he was around though. McCaw's form since the last WC hasn't always been ground breaking (i.e: ball handling skills), but his leadership, experience and intelligence is immense. And...well...he's a legend. To me, it seems like Cane has always been the understudy once he leaves. Hard to see the coaches abandoning that. At least right away. It'll be interesting though. We've definitely got a few guys to choose there.

 

[TommiG88]

Best team won, and deservedly so.