England Rugby 2018/19 Thread

[Scotty]

What does harry thacker have to do to have a shot for england? He is deffinatly on form and playing well. If hartley isnt back and we have george LCD(who im a big fan of but hasnt stepped up) who is 3rd choice?

 

[Greeno]

What does harry thacker have to do to have a shot for england? He is deffinatly on form and playing well. If hartley isnt back and we have george LCD(who im a big fan of but hasnt stepped up) who is 3rd choice?

For me Hartley will go but if he doesn't than 3rd choice is Singleton. Has been the England setup a while and has the physical attributes to play international rugby unlike Thacker. If you are going on form than Webber would be the 3rd pick.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Hartley's absence has pretty much cemented him as first choice, imo
George played better this 6N but still not his club form levels, and we don't have another leader/captain anywhere near Hartley's level

It's he back any time soon though?

 

[Scotty]

Taking world cup out of the equation for a minute. Im saying is thacker in with a shout of an england career post wc?

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Depends on the coach
With EJ probably not: his rivals are young and have more EPS (either training or playing) experience than him
I could see him getting capped on an Argentina tour during lions, or a few games vs Barbarians, but never overtake George/LCD

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Thacker is a long way from an the England shirt IMO.
He's not big enough for International rugby.

Pat Lam can say he would be getting NZ interest, but look at NZ hookers all 3 are 2 stone - 2.7 stone heavier and 3 to 4 inches taller.

As Olyy says I can see him v the Barbarians or on a England Lions tour squad, but that's about it.

 

[Nudger]

Mako is the best lh in the world
Just look at what happened in the 6 nations when we lost him to injury

 

[BPM]

Thacker is a long way from an the England shirt IMO.
He's not big enough for International rugby.

Pat Lam can say he would be getting NZ interest, but look at NZ hookers all 3 are 2 stone - 2.7 stone heavier and 3 to 4 inches taller.

As Olyy says I can see him v the Barbarians or on a England Lions tour squad, but that's about it.

Thacker is cracking player. Personally, I think he could make at test level, but I don't think he will get the chance.

Pat Lam is the Barbarians coach so I could definitely see a few Bristol players lining up against England next month. It'll be interesting to see if he picks Thacker.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

He is a cracking player.
Never questioned that, the most skilful hooker in the world potentially.

But he lacks the impact in the scrum and the rucks (Especially clearing out) to be a international hooker (Well a tier 1 hooker anyway).

 

[Bill]

He is a cracking player.
Never questioned that, the most skilful hooker in the world potentially.

But he lacks the impact in the scrum and the rucks (Especially clearing out) to be a international hooker (Well a tier 1 hooker anyway).

out of interest, how often do Bristol lose scrums against the head ?

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

out of interest, how often do Bristol lose scrums against the head ?

No idea.
But they got mashed by Tigers last week.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

He'd need to be something special at the set piece to outset his size to be honest

His lineout is good but nothing special, his scrum is good but nothing special
There's no denying his skillset away from the set piece but I think 99.9% of coaches would say he's too small for an international front row.

He's giving up 2.5st vs George, who is a pretty dynamic hooker himself when he's feeling it

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Pretty funny to see Cipriani named player of the Premiership and Goode named player of Europe.

I still wouldn't have Goode, mind.
Cipriani should have been involved in training over Smith (even if Smith is just there as an apprentice/one for the future, I'd want Cipriani involved in case Ford or Farrell breaks before the world cupa and we have to bring him in). Cipriani's form has been better and more consistent than Ford this season, however I can understand Ford being there over him for historical form/EPS experience levels.

 

[NickBD]

Agreed on both.
The media's obsession with Goode for England is frustrating. This idea England are missing out on a world class player who hasn't been given chances. He has had chance, many of them. This is probably unpopular but he's a very good premiership player but that's it.
With Cips is different, unlike Goode he hasn't been given the opportunities, he's taken less money to stay in England and he's outperformed his competition. Still no call up.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Cips really needs to be slotting over goals though.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

Agreed on both.
The media's obsession with Goode for England is frustrating. This idea England are missing out on a world class player who hasn't been given chances. He has had chance, many of them. This is probably unpopular but he's a very good premiership player but that's it.
With Cips is different, unlike Goode he hasn't been given the opportunities, he's taken less money to stay in England and he's outperformed his competition. Still no call up.

I suspect the Cips thing is down to attitude. 3 successive coaches have overlooked him (Johnson originally being the one that brought him in). There is no doubt he is a very talented played but for 3 coaches all with quite different attitudes and styles to overlook him suggests there are problems with him that we probably don't get the full extent of.

 

[BPM]

Pretty funny to see Cipriani named player of the Premiership and Goode named player of Europe.

I still wouldn't have Goode, mind.
Cipriani should have been involved in training over Smith (even if Smith is just there as an apprentice/one for the future, I'd want Cipriani involved in case Ford or Farrell breaks before the world cupa and we have to bring him in). Cipriani's form has been better and more consistent than Ford this season, however I can understand Ford being there over him for historical form/EPS experience levels.

I agree for the most part. I wouldn't have Goode either and I'd 100% have Cipriani in the squad.

I don't agree that Ford has been inconsistent though. He's been excellent all season IMO and has almost single-handedly kept Leicester up. Cipriani has been better, but given the context that Ford has been playing in a very poor side, I think he deserves a massive amount of credit.

 

[Nudger]

Is there a a training squad next week??
Thought i read it somewhere but not seen anything else??

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

I suspect the Cips thing is down to attitude. 3 successive coaches have overlooked him (Johnson originally being the one that brought him in). There is no doubt he is a very talented played but for 3 coaches all with quite different attitudes and styles to overlook him suggests there are problems with him that we probably don't get the full extent of.

Of course we don't know the whole story.

But did any of those 3 coaches have the man management skills to deal with a slightly headstrong maverick? I'd argue not. Two were way out of their depth in all aspects with humiliating RWC departures to their names and were at the helm during Cips' formative years. Jones is my way or the highway, which is always divisive and tends to over value conformity. Can't help feeling that in the hands of someone more trusting of talent and sympathetic - an Ashton type character, maybe even SCW -, especially early on the Cips story could have been very different.

Or it might just be that none of them think he can tackle. -

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Or it might just be that none of them think he can tackle. -

Me trying not to make a George Ford quip