England vs New Zealand - 19/11/22

[die_mole]

I thought It was interesting once England realized they had a chance things became a lot simpler. It was no longer telegraphed tip passes at every breakdown but rather hard runners at the defense.

 

[die_mole]

Didn't read any posts before posting that. NZ Commentary and players interviewed after the game suggesting all blacks a weren't too bad for most of it and england were good at the end.

Interesting. I had English commentary and they were quite mean to the English players. All the comments on here were quite negative as well.

 

[TommiG88]

Interesting. I had English commentary and they were quite mean to the English players. All the comments on here were quite negative as well.

I'm still negative Mole

 

[Umaga's Witness]

??????????? u wot m8

In hindsight, like lets just assume that whole "we took our foot off the gas" suggestions, that'll never happen again for the current members of this All Blacks team.

Except that's not really what happened. What happened is england got into a position where they were forced to run the ball. Any team running the ball against the all blacks has massive success in doing so.

 

[Reiser99]

We need to get rid of Billy, Nowell, Mako and Manu to start. I'd also say Hill, but no obvious replacement in the wider squad who I think would be consistently better. Possibly May as well who I think has occasional flashes, but also not much else. Sinckler would go for me as well if we had a viable alternative. Itoje needs a kick up the arse as he seems to have fallen off. We need a proper balanced back row. Tbh I am trying to remember the last time I saw Curry win a turnover at the ruck, he definitely doesn't seem to be at the level he was previously. Simmonds isn't a 6. I'd also still prefer Dombrandt as I think Simmonds is a luxury player. Smith and Farrell don't work. Pick one or the other. No major issues with JVP and Steward.

 

[Scotty]

Did we end with Porter 13 with back 3 of May Slade(15) Steward?

 

[Crash Hamster]

For the stats fiends out there: Nowell had 1 pass, 0 runs, 0 metres
No other England player got 0 metres (inc. subs) - Tuilagi, who I thought did nothing, got 25m, May got 96

Nowellwatch: from the TV, I didn't see him ball in hand at all. He did tip a couple of box kicks back on England's side, maybe that counts as a pass..?

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Did we end with Porter 13 with back 3 of May Slade(15) Steward?

Think Porter was on the wing

Nowellwatch: from the TV, I didn't see him ball in hand at all. He did tip a couple of box kicks back on England's side, maybe that counts as a pass..?

Was thinking the same - with 0m ran I'm guessing he received a kick and then tipped it on to someone else to run it back or kick

 

[Grizwald]

We need to get rid of Billy, Nowell, Mako and Manu to start. I'd also say Hill, but no obvious replacement in the wider squad who I think would be consistently better. Possibly May as well who I think has occasional flashes, but also not much else. Sinckler would go for me as well if we had a viable alternative. Itoje needs a kick up the arse as he seems to have fallen off. We need a proper balanced back row. Tbh I am trying to remember the last time I saw Curry win a turnover at the ruck, he definitely doesn't seem to be at the level he was previously. Simmonds isn't a 6. I'd also still prefer Dombrandt as I think Simmonds is a luxury player. Smith and Farrell don't work. Pick one or the other. No major issues with JVP and Steward.

Sinkler has actually been better than I expected. He's not had a good season at Bristol so far.

Nowell agree with, May has lost a couple of yards of pace. There's a lot of decent young English wingers out there.

Billy on form, don't know what it is he's been good for Sarries. I buy into the Simonds tax, you need a big unit at 6 if he plays 8 to get the most out of his game. Curry hasn't had a stand out game for a while, he did carry a lot better than B Vunipola today which didn't take much. Walking penalty Mako had genuine impact from the bench today.

Thought with nothing left to loose a lot of the younger lads started to play heads up and profited from it.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

I can see Watson getting called up for 6N's if he carries on like he did v Bath

 

[87Dreamer]

You had England on the ropes 6 - 22 and you let us back in LMAO
Pathetic

See we can do it too

Hhmmm bit of difference between being down a man and panicking and just kicking it out because you don't have the stomach

 

[Rinkadink]

Sinkler has actually been better than I expected. He's not had a good season at Bristol so far.

Lot of things wrong at Bristol but front row/scrum this season has been much improved. Uncharacteristic Newcastle away fumbles aside, not sure what you think Sinckler has done wrong these past few months?

 

[TRF_Olyy]

There was one game for Bristol where sinckler was genuinely shocking (might have been Newcastle? Can't remember - was acting like a spoiled brat all game) but generally he and Genge have been very very good as a unit this season

 

[Rinkadink]

There was one game for Bristol where sinckler was genuinely shocking (might have been Newcastle? Can't remember - was acting like a spoiled brat all game) but generally he and Genge have been very very good as a unit this season

Yeah, that was the Newcastle away game. Televised too. Embarrassing.

Season proper derailed from then on TBH but worthy of another thread. Honestly don't see any easy fixes either.

 

[Grizwald]

Lot of things wrong at Bristol but front row/scrum this season has been much improved. Uncharacteristic Newcastle away fumbles aside, not sure what you think Sinckler has done wrong these past few months?

Not been very good

 

[LIONSxv]

We need to get rid of Billy, Nowell, Mako and Manu to start. I'd also say Hill, but no obvious replacement in the wider squad who I think would be consistently better. Possibly May as well who I think has occasional flashes, but also not much else. Sinckler would go for me as well if we had a viable alternative. Itoje needs a kick up the arse as he seems to have fallen off. We need a proper balanced back row. Tbh I am trying to remember the last time I saw Curry win a turnover at the ruck, he definitely doesn't seem to be at the level he was previously. Simmonds isn't a 6. I'd also still prefer Dombrandt as I think Simmonds is a luxury player. Smith and Farrell don't work. Pick one or the other. No major issues with JVP and Steward.

I agree with almost of that. An interesting note on T Curry. When he first burst on the scene he was lean dexterous breakdown specialist. He was at most 100kg. He has put on a good 10kg and with that has lost a yard of pace. He is definitely slower to the breakdown but a notably better carrier and more dominant in the tackle area.
I have no issue with putting bulk on if he is played as a 6. Curry at six and Willis at 7 with a dombrandt at 8 is good mix of skill and physicality.

 

[Scotty]

Hhmmm bit of difference between being down a man and panicking and just kicking it out because you don't have the stomach

Tbh i think we should have played on and gone for it. Calling it pathetic i thought was abit harsh tbf. And i was only taking the **** saying pathetic back i couldnt resist.

 

[Reiser99]

I agree with almost of that. An interesting note on T Curry. When he first burst on the scene he was lean dexterous breakdown specialist. He was at most 100kg. He has put on a good 10kg and with that has lost a yard of pace. He is definitely slower to the breakdown but a notably better carrier and more dominant in the tackle area.
I have no issue with putting bulk on if he is played as a 6. Curry at six and Willis at 7 with a dombrandt at 8 is good mix of skill and physicality.

Make a good point about Curry and weight. Is he another player EJ has ruined (or at least made worse) by demanding he bulk up to play anywhere in the backrow rather than leaving him to do what he's good at?

 

[TommiG88]

Tbh i think we should have played on and gone for it. Calling it pathetic i thought was abit harsh tbf. And i was only taking the **** saying pathetic back i couldnt resist.

87Dreamer is a bit of a troll, so take it with a pinch of salt

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Make a good point about Curry and weight. Is he another player EJ has ruined (or at least made worse) by demanding he bulk up to play anywhere in the backrow rather than leaving him to do what he's good at?

Think the bulk definitely has impacted but he's still playing fantastically well for Sale

Another player that just looks muted for England - when's the last time we really attacked the breakdown?