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[RWC2019][The Final] England vs. South Africa (02/11/2019)

RedruthRFC said:
I was pleased by the lack of a massive celebration last week, but it's not something I can get too excitied about. It's an obvious psychological point, which explains the coverage that it has received, but that being the case, I'd imagine that it was something that had been talked about before the match. Fair play to the players for sticking to the plan though.

What has impressed me is the demeanour of the players and I've been surprised how little comment it has received here or elsewhere. There seems to be a collective awareness within the team of the need to stay in the right mental state (I don't know how better to express what I mean). There's no more seal impressions from Itoje, Sinkler kept his cool when things could have gone Wales shaped against Australia (thanks in part to team mates being aware of the potential and keeping an eye on him), no more Marler getting carried away, pats on the back for players who have made mistakes and recognition of positive contributions without going over the top. Whoever is responsible for instigating this change in attitude deserves a big pat on the back.

On the amateur sports psychology theme, you could argue that the England team had become a bit of a personification of Eddie Jones' mindset. They seem much better off for winding it in a few notches.
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England bought in a new sports psychologist after the Scotland game didn't they? Probably where the change stemmed from.
 
spartan32 said:
On another note. I'm going to be in Franschhoek for the big day. Any recommendations from the Saffers out there of a place to watch the game?
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Just walk in the main street in front of the monument, there's plenty of bars and restaurants where you will be able to watch. Follow the Saffers...
 
RedruthRFC said:
I was pleased by the lack of a massive celebration last week, but it's not something I can get too excitied about. It's an obvious psychological point, which explains the coverage that it has received, but that being the case, I'd imagine that it was something that had been talked about before the match. Fair play to the players for sticking to the plan though.

What has impressed me is the demeanour of the players and I've been surprised how little comment it has received here or elsewhere. There seems to be a collective awareness within the team of the need to stay in the right mental state (I don't know how better to express what I mean). There's no more seal impressions from Itoje, Sinkler kept his cool when things could have gone Wales shaped against Australia (thanks in part to team mates being aware of the potential and keeping an eye on him), no more Marler getting carried away, pats on the back for players who have made mistakes and recognition of positive contributions without going over the top. Whoever is responsible for instigating this change in attitude deserves a big pat on the back.

On the amateur sports psychology theme, you could argue that the England team had become a bit of a personification of Eddie Jones' mindset. They seem much better off for winding it in a few notches.
Click to expand...

They're men on a mission, and it shows
 
Too much to respond to on here so forgive me for simply generalizing but you English blokes can't say (think its was @ncurd) in one breath that its too long a wait simply having polite acknowledgements that England are favorites and saying but we still believe its ours regardless and then wanting us to give up our biases and hopes before we've even begun. Its just cruel. We need to leave some fat out there to chew on in the meantime in any case.

I'll accept England are favorites. I give it 60/40. I still maintain SA has had better prep and that England hasn't been tested. They dominated and haven't had any sort of push back whatsoever this entire RWC. I think SA having had to scrap for a win vs Wales and having had a scare vs Japan (at half time) and having had a loss vs NZ all while having Garces who we have in the final is the better preparation of the two for what are two fairly inexperienced teams (as far as RWC finalists go) going into a RWC final. This all assumes that the final will be a scrap. The 20% England has on us is England walking over us. I'm thinking more along the lines of SA has a damn good shot of it the other 40% either way of it being close. England trouncing us would surprise me. Possibly my view is too long term based. I don't know. I even harbor the hope that we are holding some cards back (I had a good chuckle in my cuff at NZ fans who held that notion while losing out in the RC so I know how ridiculous that is but there you have it!). IF England klap us then in that case I'd acknowledge I know nothing of rugby all the while blaming Garces of course. In the meantime I'll wait quietly confident.

spartan32 said:
On another note. I'm going to be in Franschhoek for the big day. Any recommendations from the Saffers out there of a place to watch the game?
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Not Franschhoek. Way too posh and filled with pretense and foreigners.

Nah, just joking (sort of). What kindof experience are you hoping for? I'd say go watch with the students at Stellenbosch. Close enough to your location.
 
Last edited:
An attempt at some balanced neutrality (ha)

  • I think England are a better team. Not to say that SA can't beat them, because they can, but overall I just think England have a slightly better pack and much better backs (or are at least much better at using them)
  • Kolbe scares me more than May as someone who's watched both of them play against my teams, but they're both amazing players and I'd echo what I said earlier and say that England are much better at getting the ball into May's hands in space where he can do damage than SA are with Kolbe. They're both carrying injuries though so who knows how effective either will be.
  • Don't buy the idea that England have already played their final, don't think Jones would let that happen. Extra rest day is far more relevant I think.
  • I think a close penalty oriented game is pretty much 50/50, if SA manage to keep England tryless then they have a great shot. If their defence isn't completely on point though I think it's England's trophy, they look much more able to score a try if they need it (whereas a lot of SA's attacking seems to be to hope Kolbe does something without even making much of an effort to give him the ball).
  • Don't really see the issue with Garces, he's not perfect but he's pretty good. Being French counts against him because people seem to lump them all in as one and then attack them as a group whenever one of them does something wrong they all get the blame. With Owens injured he's the best option available (although I reckon he'd have gotten it anyway even with Nige fit).
Pretty much just my thoughts on the matter, if anyone disagrees take a look at my signature.
 
So. If you're the better team, so much so that you win comfortably against any opposition it's clear you haven't been tested.

Basically, to be tested we had to play worse? THAT IS INSANE.

What do we have to do ffs?

I'd rather come into this game winning vs NZ than being tested in a defeat against them

NZ were never tested, still won things.
 
ragerancher said:
England bought in a new sports psychologist after the Scotland game didn't they? Probably where the change stemmed from.
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Hadn't heard that, but if there was any time to do it, it would have been then! I was wondering if it was John Mitchell's influence starting to take hold, but it seemed like it would have made more sense if that had yielded a marked improvement in the time it takes them to down a yard of ale!
 
TRF_Olyy said:
Always makes me laugh when people are like "STICK THAT ON THE DRESSING ROOM WALL, THERES YOUR MOTIVATION". Didn't work too well for the Argentinians bleating all week about English history and going to "war".

These players won't give a single **** about Farrell's tackle. He's done nothing even remotely vaguely controversial this tournament, so hinging your hopes on him doing an illegal shot is gonna end in heartbreak.
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They can do what they like to him, he'll just smirk.
 
unrated said:
Just heard John smit say on nz rugby program the breakdown that the Springbok defence was so ferocious with the gain line the Wales only averaged 1.6m per run which according to them was the least ever in a world Cup game. Thank god for some positivity with all the shooting down of the South African team. Getting more confident by the day. I for one will be absolutely gutted if we lose the final. ONLY the final is not good enough


If a nz poster who has playback abilities for this program can please watch the program again and double fact check this statement that would be appreciated
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Opta stats have confirmed it:
https://twitter.com/OptaJonny/status/1188753592280322050?s=19
 
I really want South Africa to win. I just don't see it happening unless england blew their load against New Zealand. I think that's really doubtful as I'm sure they've been recovering well and these teams have tournament management down to a science.

really regret not putting money on england before the tournament.
 
themole25 said:
I really want South Africa to win. I just don't see it happening unless england blew their load against New Zealand. I think that's really doubtful as I'm sure they've been recovering well and these teams have tournament management down to a science.

really regret not putting money on england before the tournament.
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Oh we blew our load against NZ but the thing is we blow an entirely new one after 7 days of saving it up ;)
 

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