[RWC2019][Quarter-Final 1] England vs. Australia (19/10/2019)

[spartan32]

Lots of lovely English arrogance here. Jolly good to see.

however:..

Australia just can't be taken for granted. England have not yet shown up tot this World Cup. Pretty conservative performances, lots of injury ****les, and nothing that I would call consistent. The Aussies have the likes of Pooper, Karevi, even Genia can pull some pretty decent stuff out, Taylor Petty is also pretty handy.
England will need to come out firing, aggressive in contact areas, dealing with the Aussie Jackals, and co trolling the tempo. Faz will have to kick all his chances and the decision making will need to be impeccable.
This is by no means a nailed on win for England. They are going to need to fight for it and I expect it to be close.

 

[Derpus]

England by 20 or so if we play a typical Aus performance. Might be able to reduce it to 10 if we play well.

Then, merciful gods be praised, we can begin life without Cheika.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

Place your bets on which law Cheika will claim he doesn't understand if Aus lose this game. Got to be something to do with the breakdown.

 

[bushytop]

Place your bets on which law Cheika will claim he doesn't understand if Aus lose this game. Got to be something to do with the breakdown.

Isn't not understanding laws what landed most of these peoples' ancestors in Australia in the first place?

 

[TRF_heineken]

Isn't not understanding laws what landed most of these peoples' ancestors in Australia in the first place?

Apparently Lebanon has a language barrier too when they send people like Cheika there...

 

[bushytop]

Apparently Lebanon has a language barrier too when they send people like Cheika there...

All jokes aside... I actually like Cheika's (& Jones for that matter) might not agree with them all that much but their opinions & delivery of such, make me smile.

 

[MojoPin]

As with all the matchups this weekend, it could go either way. I know some people have said that England "haven't shown up yet" but to me they seem quietly assured and have an absolutely towering performance lying in wait. They just seem such a complete and balanced team these days. If Australia's half backs were more settled I might think differently, so a lot rides on selection when it comes to the Wallabies.

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

As with all the matchups this weekend, it could go either way. I know some people have said that England "haven't shown up yet" but to me they seem quietly assured and have an absolutely towering performance lying in wait. They just seem such a complete and balanced team these days. If Australia's half backs were more settled I might think differently, so a lot rides on selection when it comes to the Wallabies.

I keep reading stuff like this but really can't see where it comes from. Maybe on paper, but utterly unproven on grass.

RWC so far. 2 minnows and 14 man Arg. Can't read anything into those. Or the warm ups that went before.

So it's back to the 6N for anything meaningful and that was a total mixed bag. Sublime against Ire, and ridiculous against Sco. The mental softness we showed v Sco and others beforehand bothers me far more than having lost a little momentum in a week off. Really not convinced how we'll react when the going gets tough. Opponents know we've shown a soft centre on a number of occasions.

TBH the Aussies best chance is to throw the first half and let us build a lead.

 

[bushytop]

I keep reading stuff like this but really can't see where it comes from. Maybe on paper, but utterly unproven on grass.

RWC so far. 2 minnows and 14 man Arg. Can't read anything into those. Or the warm ups that went before.

So it's back to the 6N for anything meaningful and that was a total mixed bag. Sublime against Ire, and ridiculous against Sco. The mental softness we showed v Sco and others beforehand bothers me far more than having lost a little momentum in a week off. Really not convinced how we'll react when the going gets tough. Opponents know we've shown a soft centre on a number of occasions.

TBH the Aussies best chance is to throw the first half and let us build a lead.

 

[TheSaffycen]

Don't feel confident about this game, I'm going to say England less than a score. But wouldn't be shocked for a Aussie win

 

[Reiser99]

For me personally while our performances weren't great we haven't really performed better or worse than most other teams in the quarter finals. In terms of world rankings we definitely had the toughest group.

Going into the world cup...
Pool A had a combined ranking of 55.
Pool B had a combined ranking of 65. (Also had the widest gap between NZ and Namibia)
Pool C had a combined ranking of 49. (Tonga was the highest of the bottom ranked sides in each pool)
Pool D had a combined ranking of 51.

Ireland and Scotland both lost to Japan, which going into the tournament wasn't expected. Ireland didn't have a great game against Russia and the only real time they've looked good was to an awful Samoa side. Japan have performed well above expectations and look, but even they struggled early against Russia.
NZ and S.A have looked pretty good, but apart from facing each other they've had the easiest pool by far and even then not without blips. N.Z struggled in the first half against Namibia.
France haven't looked consistent at all this tournament and have produced some awful displays at times.
Australia could well have lost to Fiji under different circumstances and didn't look great against Georgia. Wales got the key win against Australia, but also haven't looked great in the last two games.

Basically the tournament is like a 1600m race. You spend the start and middle getting into your rhythm, testing out the opposition and try to get through with as little damage as possible so you can push on. England got the bonus point in all 4 games and have come through without any major injuries. On top got a chance to rest players and avoid further injuries. Yes some of the rugby wasn't perfect, but England needed to do the job against those opponents. I'm sure we'll see them step up, just like every other team will. However there does seem to be a little bit too much negativity on performances that for me are largely irrelevant now.

 

[Nudger]

Mako George Sinclair
Kruz maro
Curry underhill Billy
Youngs Farrell many jj
May Watson Daley
Genge LCD Cole
Lawes ludlam
Hienz Ford JC


But what do I know?

 

[bushytop]

For me personally while our performances weren't great we haven't really performed better or worse than most other teams in the quarter finals. In terms of world rankings we definitely had the toughest group.

Going into the world cup...
Pool A had a combined ranking of 55.
Pool B had a combined ranking of 65. (Also had the widest gap between NZ and Namibia)
Pool C had a combined ranking of 49. (Tonga was the highest of the bottom ranked sides in each pool)
Pool D had a combined ranking of 51.

Ireland and Scotland both lost to Japan, which going into the tournament wasn't expected. Ireland didn't have a great game against Russia and the only real time they've looked good was to an awful Samoa side. Japan have performed well above expectations and look, but even they struggled early against Russia.
NZ and S.A have looked pretty good, but apart from facing each other they've had the easiest pool by far and even then not without blips. N.Z struggled in the first half against Namibia.
France haven't looked consistent at all this tournament and have produced some awful displays at times.
Australia could well have lost to Fiji under different circumstances and didn't look great against Georgia. Wales got the key win against Australia, but also haven't looked great in the last two games.

Basically the tournament is like a 1600m race. You spend the start and middle getting into your rhythm, testing out the opposition and try to get through with as little damage as possible so you can push on. England got the bonus point in all 4 games and have come through without any major injuries. On top got a chance to rest players and avoid further injuries. Yes some of the rugby wasn't perfect, but England needed to do the job against those opponents. I'm sure we'll see them step up, just like every other team will. However there does seem to be a little bit too much negativity on performances that for me are largely irrelevant now.

Agree with the sentiment behind a lot (if not all) of this. I 'personally' wouldn't say that Pool C was the toughest but I appreciate your argument and use of the Rankings as evidence (although most people moan that the rankings mean nothing).

As it stands I would have New Zealand as favourites with SA, England and Wales together behind them.

 

[Scotty]

I would feel more confident if we played the French and got some minutes into the likes of Mako, Slade, Nowell Ect. Could have got up to 60 min into all 3 of them. Who makes the bench for this one? JJ or Slade and Nowell or Big Joe? I imagine it will be Youngs Ford May Faz Manu Watson Daly. Heinz Slade/JJ Nowell/Big Joe.

 

[Reiser99]

Agree with the sentiment behind a lot (if not all) of this. I 'personally' wouldn't say that Pool C was the toughest but I appreciate your argument and use of the Rankings as evidence (although most people moan that the rankings mean nothing).

As it stands I would have New Zealand as favourites with SA, England and Wales together behind them.

I definitely agree it wasn't the toughest group in the end and I did say on purely on world rankings. My point was that we didn't really have any game against teams like Namibia and Canada and that Tonga and USA aren't awful, so not having perfect performances against them and not scoring 35 and 45 points against them respectively is not bad at all.

I would agree with those 4 teams, though as I just highlighted in the Wales thread I don't think Australia have been as awful as some people make out and I also think if Ireland can click then they can easily upset any team. Also we honestly have no idea how N.Z, England and France will be affected by the longer break and if it helps or hinders them. However I'm confident if we play our game well, don't give away silly penalties or cards then we will win by 10+. If we don't play well or our discipline is bad then it's anyone's game.

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

For me personally while our performances weren't great we haven't really performed better or worse than most other teams in the quarter finals. In terms of world rankings we definitely had the toughest group.

Going into the world cup...
Pool A had a combined ranking of 55.
Pool B had a combined ranking of 65. (Also had the widest gap between NZ and Namibia)
Pool C had a combined ranking of 49. (Tonga was the highest of the bottom ranked sides in each pool)
Pool D had a combined ranking of 51.

Ireland and Scotland both lost to Japan, which going into the tournament wasn't expected. Ireland didn't have a great game against Russia and the only real time they've looked good was to an awful Samoa side. Japan have performed well above expectations and look, but even they struggled early against Russia.
NZ and S.A have looked pretty good, but apart from facing each other they've had the easiest pool by far and even then not without blips. N.Z struggled in the first half against Namibia.
France haven't looked consistent at all this tournament and have produced some awful displays at times.
Australia could well have lost to Fiji under different circumstances and didn't look great against Georgia. Wales got the key win against Australia, but also haven't looked great in the last two games.

Basically the tournament is like a 1600m race. You spend the start and middle getting into your rhythm, testing out the opposition and try to get through with as little damage as possible so you can push on. England got the bonus point in all 4 games and have come through without any major injuries. On top got a chance to rest players and avoid further injuries. Yes some of the rugby wasn't perfect, but England needed to do the job against those opponents. I'm sure we'll see them step up, just like every other team will. However there does seem to be a little bit too much negativity on performances that for me are largely irrelevant now.

Did you have a fairly vivid dream Saturday morning there? England have only played three matches, missing the game against the second seed makes the only pool rankings fairly irrelevant.

 

[bushytop]

I definitely agree it wasn't the toughest group in the end and I did say on purely on world rankings. My point was that we didn't really have any game against teams like Namibia and Canada and that Tonga and USA aren't awful, so not having perfect performances against them and not scoring 35 and 45 points against them respectively is not bad at all.

I would agree with those 4 teams, though as I just highlighted in the Wales thread I don't think Australia have been as awful as some people make out and I also think if Ireland can click then they can easily upset any team. Also we honestly have no idea how N.Z, England and France will be affected by the longer break and if it helps or hinders them. However I'm confident if we play our game well, don't give away silly penalties or cards then we will win by 10+. If we don't play well or our discipline is bad then it's anyone's game.

Yeah Oz are no mugs... we just seem to make heavier weather of them than anyone else does.

 

[Reiser99]

Did you have a fairly vivid dream Saturday morning there? England have only played three matches, missing the game against the second seed makes the only pool rankings fairly irrelevant.

Fair play, BP in 3 games. I'm definitely not saying the rankings are the ultimate measure of where teams are, but I wanted to give some perspective to the fact that while England haven't played perfectly, no team has and some people seem to imply that England have struggled more than other teams this world cup, when I'd say most have had pretty even amounts of up and downs.

 

[bushytop]

There are question marks over all teams in the QF's even the All Blacks... there are just less for them.

 

[Which Tyler]

However I'm confident if we play our game well, don't give away silly penalties or cards then we will win by 10+.

So... which is it?