[RWC2019][Semi-Final 1] England vs. New Zealand (26/10/2019)

[Jimbo]

Help me out folks. I won't deny that I'm not a great technician of the game as my extreme lack of talent meant I stopped playing as a kid. However, it never stopped my love for the game. Despite my lack of in depth technical nous, I do.manage to predict outcomes quite well. For example, I never saw anything other than a stuffing for Ireland from the ABs and I also saw Wales losing to France, which they almost did.

My concern is that I can really see England getting roasted on Saturday...and I'm right too often.

Can any of you more clued up folk allay my fears. I'll be watching on the Algarve with mainly Welsh folk and the thought of my predicted drubbing is hurting.

How the fluke can we win this? We're simply not good enough, are we?

I don't know, all I would say is if anyone can it's England.

 

[BPM]

I'm not expecting England to win, but I am expecting it to be fairly close. It's a reasonably long time since the NZ had a entirely comfortable victory over us.

 

[Mrs. Peter Quinn]

Just because someone mentioned it, I have to deal mentally with the England vs Wales thing for a second.
If it happens and we lose, I will delete my TRF account and jump off a bridge, in no particular order.
(Unless it happens as a 3rd place playoff, in which case I won't delete my TRF account but I'll still have to jump off the bridge)
Now that's out of the way:

If England met NZ in an identical fixture repeated 10 times (fatigue not being a thing) I reckon England could win 3 of them.
So obviously yes I think we can win, it's just not the most likely outcome on the day.
It's definitely worth noting that last time we met we almost won but for that final try being ruled out.
Noone remembers really because they were too busy creaming themselves about Ireland winning the week after
But on the other hand, we did have home advantage and I think New Zealand are playing better right now.

What's stressful about playing NZ is that good teams could contain them for 60 minutes, and then in the next 3 minutes they could score 3 tries out of nowhere. With any other team you can afford to switch off briefly, but not here.

 

[Kiwiwomble]

Help me out folks. I won't deny that I'm not a great technician of the game as my extreme lack of talent meant I stopped playing as a kid. However, it never stopped my love for the game. Despite my lack of in depth technical nous, I do.manage to predict outcomes quite well. For example, I never saw anything other than a stuffing for Ireland from the ABs and I also saw Wales losing to France, which they almost did.

My concern is that I can really see England getting roasted on Saturday...and I'm right too often.

Can any of you more clued up folk allay my fears. I'll be watching on the Algarve with mainly Welsh folk and the thought of my predicted drubbing is hurting.

How the fluke can we win this? We're simply not good enough, are we?

this is gold, i got one right and the other one almost right which means im real good at predicting

i dont think we can use results against each other to judge anything just because we haven't played enough recently

the only stat we can use is the world rankings, which for their flaws, give a rating based on results against at least some of the same opposition....and NZ are one and England are two...this tells me NZ are favorites but not by much and there for it could be close

England have looked in better form than Ireland did which in my mind takes "could be close" to "probably will be close"...and if two teams are close then the end result could be anything, one lucky/unlucky bounce of the ball could decide it

 

[tsof]

Just because someone mentioned it, I have to deal mentally with the England vs Wales thing for a second.
If it happens and we lose, I will delete my TRF account and jump off a bridge, in no particular order.
(Unless it happens as a 3rd place playoff, in which case I won't delete my TRF account but I'll still have to jump off the bridge)
Now that's out of the way:

It's definitely worth noting that last time we met we almost won but for that final try being ruled out.
Noone remembers really because they were too busy creaming themselves about Ireland winning the week after
But on the other hand, we did have home advantage and I think New Zealand are playing better right now.

The thing I really take heart/cling on to hope from that game is that our team has strengthened exponentially since then. The likes of Shields, Ewels, Williams, Hartley, Hepburn, Moon, Te'o all featured that day and now cant even make the WC squad. Sure, NZ have also strengthened and added to their game plan, but if you contrast the two teams then-and-now, I would suggest that England have increased the quality of their team significantly more.

 

[donmcdazzle]

Among plenty of other things, one specific area that is causing me a fair few concerns is the scrummaging of Ta'avao off the bench. Despite being a pretty huge guy, he has never been that great in the scrum. He has obviously worked hard on that area of his game, but having to face the English reserve props of Cole and Marler (who I think are exceptional in the scrum), that could be an area where if the game is close as we all expect, England may have an edge in the final 30 or so minutes.

Ofa is fine, he can scrum with anyone, but Ta'avao is a worry, despite his work elsewhere.

 

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

Among plenty of other things, one specific area that is causing me a fair few concerns is the scrummaging of Ta'avao off the bench. Despite being a pretty huge guy, he has never been that great in the scrum. He has obviously worked hard on that area of his game, but having to face the English reserve props of Cole and Marler (who I think are exceptional in the scrum), that could be an area where if the game is close as we all expect, England may have an edge in the final 30 or so minutes.

Ofa is fine, he can scrum with anyone, but Ta'avao is a worry, despite his work elsewhere.

Ofa gets quite a lot of stick but the fact that he can scrummage at both loosehead and tighthead at international level and never look out of place is genuinely remarkable.

 

[Pom in Exile]

The prevailing opinion in Oz seems to be that England will get pumped by the ABs although that might be more a wish than a prediction. Frankly though the RWC has effectively ceased to be now that the Wallabies are out and the witch-hunt has begun in earnest with Cheika copping plenty along with anyone in a senior role with anything to do with Australian rugby.

FWIW, I feel that the NZ are rightly favourites but I have a feeling in my bones (that I should probably get checked) that England just might do it. This very well may just be based on blind hope but ultimately that's what life and sport is all about otherwise if it's just done on paper, what's the point?

NZ definitely blew the cobwebs out against Ireland and looked extremely impressive, especially their offloading game which is exceptional anyway but it was on another level against Ireland, selective, accurate and deadly.
It has to be said though that Ireland were utterly pants, as bad as you'll ever likely see them, although how much that was down to Ireland and how much that was down to the ABs is difficult to measure, probably a bit of both.

England on the other hand have managed to keep their powder pretty dry and have done what was required without necessarily making a huge statement although it could be argued putting 40 on the Wallabies is a bit of an exclamation that we are ready.
The question obviously remains as to whether England will be able to handle the extra pace, physicality and rugby smarts of the ABs and whether England can increase their intensity without seeing the error and penalty count rapidly getting out of control.
One simply has to believe that England have been preparing for this match ever since the draw was made and that they are ready for a war and ready to leave every ounce of themselves on the field to achieve their goal. If that's not enough then so be it and congratulations to the ABs.

I believe and I hope...I know that it's the hope that kills you but it's also what keeps drawing us back in for more.

P.S I hope beyond hope that this match (both matches actually) is decided by the players and not the officials.

Can't wait.

 

[Kiwiwomble]

The prevailing opinion in Oz seems to be that England will get pumped by the ABs although that might be more a wish than a prediction. Frankly though the RWC has effectively ceased to be now that the Wallabies are out and the witch-hunt has begun in earnest with Cheika copping plenty along with anyone in a senior role with anything to do with Australian rugby.

FWIW, I feel that the NZ are rightly favourites but I have a feeling in my bones (that I should probably get checked) that England just might do it. This very well may just be based on blind hope but ultimately that's what life and sport is all about otherwise if it's just done on paper, what's the point?

NZ definitely blew the cobwebs out against Ireland and looked extremely impressive, especially their offloading game which is exceptional anyway but it was on another level against Ireland, selective, accurate and deadly.
It has to be said though that Ireland were utterly pants, as bad as you'll ever likely see them, although how much that was down to Ireland and how much that was down to the ABs is difficult to measure, probably a bit of both.

England on the other hand have managed to keep their powder pretty dry and have done what was required without necessarily making a huge statement although it could be argued putting 40 on the Wallabies is a bit of an exclamation that we are ready.
The question obviously remains as to whether England will be able to handle the extra pace, physicality and rugby smarts of the ABs and whether England can increase their intensity without seeing the error and penalty count rapidly getting out of control.
One simply has to believe that England have been preparing for this match ever since the draw was made and that they are ready for a war and ready to leave every ounce of themselves on the field to achieve their goal. If that's not enough then so be it and congratulations to the ABs.

I believe and I hope...I know that it's the hope that kills you but it's also what keeps drawing us back in for more.

P.S I hope beyond hope that this match (both matches actually) is decided by the players and not the officials.

Can't wait.

you're lucky you found someone to talk to about rugby in Aus! i struggle, one of the few i know is Irish and now he's not talking to me about anything other than work

 

[Kapa O Pango]

I still believe Jones and Hansen still have a few tricks on up their sleeves.

Hansen relieving they are cloning another Barrett.

 

[Pom in Exile]

you're lucky you found someone to talk to about rugby in Aus! i struggle, one of the few i know is Irish and now he's not talking to me about anything other than work

You're not wrong especially in Adelaide, I've got an Aussie mate who's originally from NSW who loves his rugby and a Kiwi mate who it goes without saying loves his rugby. Watching the game this week with the Aussie...for obvious reasons.

 

[donmcdazzle]

You're not wrong especially in Adelaide, I've got an Aussie mate who's originally from NSW who loves his rugby and a Kiwi mate who it goes without saying loves his rugby. Watching the game this week with the Aussie...for obvious reasons.

I'm in Melbourne, have to wade through 7-8 pages of AFL and horse racing before you see a mention of the WC. One bloke from Brisbane gives it a watch but not much outside that!

 

[Pom in Exile]

I'm in Melbourne, have to wade through 7-8 pages of AFL and horse racing before you see a mention of the WC. One bloke from Brisbane gives it a watch but not much outside that!

Haha yeah Melbourne the sporting capital of the world apparently. I have a great mate who's lived in Melbourne for 20 years or so now and he has a group who go to Rebel's games then on for dinner etc, all very civilised. It's a mixture of Poms, kiwis and a few Aussies I believe. He's actually attending the semis with one of the kiwis and they're working their way through some of Japan's best restaurants too...lucky ********.

 

[The_Wol]

Never in history have I wanted England to win a game of Rugby until this game.

 

[Pom in Exile]

Never in history have I wanted England to win a game of Rugby until this game.

Welcome aboard mate, don't burn yourself on the chariot.

 

[Kiwiwomble]

I'm in Melbourne, have to wade through 7-8 pages of AFL and horse racing before you see a mention of the WC. One bloke from Brisbane gives it a watch but not much outside that!

im in Melbourne too, got into the AFL?

its one of the reasons i got ****** at the super rugby conference system, the highlanders played in melbourne once in four years, i dragged along anyone that didn't have an excuse last year

 

[The_Wol]

Welcome aboard mate, don't burn yourself on the chariot.

After this we're done tho, England can take Jonny Wilkinson and stick him up their clacker.

 

[Pom in Exile]

After this we're done tho, England can take Jonny Wilkinson and stick him up their clacker.

Fair enough, the enemy of my enemy is my friend sort of thing? You must not like the ABs A LOT.

 

[The_Wol]

Fair enough, the enemy of my enemy is my friend sort of thing? You must not like the ABs A LOT.

A mate lives in my house who is a Kiwi, he never shuts up about them he shows me Haka Flashmob videos like he's a 55 year old mother who just discovered the internet. I never used to dislike the AB's this much but I hope they get smashed just so I can kick the door off the hinges and haw haw in his face.

 

[Kapa O Pango]

A mate lives in my house who is a Kiwi, he never shuts up about them he shows me Haka Flashmob videos like he's a 55 year old mother who just discovered the internet. I never used to dislike the AB's this much but I hope they get smashed just so I can kick the door off the hinges and haw haw in his face.